M40 / M40A1 Sling Swivels

[GregV]

I recently purchased a McMillan stock for my M40A1 project. It came with 1&1/2 in. Wichita swivels. From what I have read, original M40A1's had 1&1/4 in. swivels. Can anyone confirm this? It seems that 1&1/4 in. swivels are not available anywhere. Does anyone know if they even exist? Not a big deal, just curious.

Also, I hear that a lot of guys use Wichita swivels on their M40 clones. I didn't think that Wichita started making their swivels until the 70's. I've seen a picture, in Senich's book, of an original M40 with what looks like Remington 513T type swivels installed. The 513T swivels that I have are also 1&1/2 ins. wide (inside). On the early M40's, were the wood screw type used on both the front and rear? Were they 1&1/4 or 1&1/2 in. ?

Thanks, Greg V

[pete-z]

M40 / M40A1 Sling Swivels
I recently purchased a McMillan stock for my M40A1 project. It came with 1&1/2 in. Wichita swivels. From what I have read, original M40A1's had 1&1/4 in. swivels. Can anyone confirm this? It seems that 1&1/4 in. swivels are not available anywhere. Does anyone know if they even exist? Not a big deal, just curious.
Also, I hear that a lot of guys use Wichita swivels on their M40 clones. I didn't think that Wichita started making their swivels until the 70's. I've seen a picture, in Senich's book, of an original M40 with what looks like Remington 513T type swivels installed. The 513T swivels that I have are also 1&1/2 ins. wide (inside). On the early M40's, were the wood screw type used on both the front and rear? Were they 1&1/4 or 1&1/2 in. ?

Thanks, Greg V



The original M40 was supplied with 1 1/4" swivels. Rear was the wood screw type and the front threaded into the escucheon.
The M40A1 has 1 1/2" swivels. Wicihta most probably. At least they supplied the USMC with them.
1 1/4 swivels are not available, that I have found. I would like to find some too... The thickness of the ring stock is usually smaller than the
correct size (Wichita's are the correct thickness not the length though 1 1/2). 5/32" is the correct stock diameter.

They can be made from the Wichita or Remington swivels by replacing the rings. Not that difficult to do.

The museum rifles do not all have the correct swivels, be careful of pictures of them.[/B]

[Badgerord]

I have 2 Air Force M40's and one Marine M40 as well as 2 M40A1 rifles, ALL have 1.1/2" swivels, these are REAL not repro rifles. The swivels used on the 1966-1970 M40 rifles are of unknown origin, probably made buy Remington.

The swivels on the M40's are identical to the swivels on the return stocks from McMillan/USMC, they were probably made from the same plans.
I measured 6 sets and all of the fall between 1.475" and 1.5" inside the loop.

Wichita did and does make the M40 swivels, if you read this excerpt from their history page:

"Years came and went. The reloading die business was closed due to other business obligations even though the sales were extraordinary. The call of the shooting sports could not be shaken and in 1970 the Jackson’s obtained an order to manufacture a Sling Swivel for the M40 military rifle. Must have made a good part for 32 years later it is still being manufactured."

See whole history here http://www.wichitaarms.com/history.asp

This is a price list circa 2006 but I purchased 2 sets of Issue swivels just 3 months ago, they still sell the. http://www.wichitaarms.com/Products/WichitaArms-PriceList.pdf

Marty
Badger Ordnance

[stars-n-bars]

Bagerord, Can you post a picture of the buttplate ? My Rem. 700P came with a plain wooden stock with a skelton looking buttplate. I have a couple of different Rem. buttplates and would like to put the proper one on this stock. I would like my rifle to appear as close to an M40A1 as possible.

[pete-z]

I have 2 Air Force M40's and one Marine M40 as well as 2 M40A1 rifles, ALL have 1.1/2" swivels, these are REAL not repro rifles. The swivels used on the 1966-1970 M40 rifles are of unknown origin, probably made buy Remington.

The swivels on the M40's are identical to the swivels on the return stocks from McMillan/USMC, they were probably made from the same plans.
I measured 6 sets and all of the flee between 1.475" and 1.5" insdie the loop.

Wichita did and does make the M40 swivels, if you read this excerpt from their history page:

"Years came and went. The reloading die business was closed due to other business obligations even though the sales were extraordinary. The call of the shooting sports could not be shaken and in 1970 the Jackson’s obtained an order to manufacture a Sling Swivel for the M40 military rifle. Must have made a good part for 32 years later it is still being manufactured."

See whole history here http://www.wichitaarms.com/history.asp

This is a price lost circa 2006 but I purchased 2 sets of Issue swivels just 3 months ago, they still sell the. http://www.wichitaarms.com/Products/WichitaArms-PriceList.pdf

Marty
Badger Ordnance

The original M40 USMC spec asked for 1 1/4 swivels. Remington did have drawings for an 1 1/4 swivel for the contract. Whether they actually put them on the rifles, I
cannot say. I have never seen an actual Remington 1 1/4 swivel in person. They were supposed to have been provided on the first contract per Remington documents. Subsequent request rifles may
or may not have had the 1 1/4 swivel. The 1 1/2 swivel may have been supplied early on from a contractor.

The more I try to get information on the swivels, the closer I get to believing very few 1 1/4 swivels were made, if at all.

The museums have 1 1/2 swivels on the rifles I have seen, including the Remington museum. There could be additional reasons for these examples.

Your M40's are later numbers? Very likely they would have the 1 1/2" swivels.

As for the M40A1's. Probably all had the 1 1/2 swivels. All I have seen do.

I have made a real effort to get info on the M40. Still in the collection stage.

Not building rifles, just interested in the detail of the rifle from the technical end. I would rather buy a correct example.

I have recently bought Wichita swivels and talked with them.

Thanks for the reply.

[Badgerord]

The build order probably called out swivels to fit a 1 1/4" sling so 1 1/2" swivels will fit a 1 1/4" sling, just spitballing.

The Marine rifle is in the 200K range so early, 1967 or 68 it has 1 1/4"

S-n-B
The M40A1 has a fiberglass stock and a Pachmayr 1/2" Brown pad, the M40 has a wood stock and uses a die cast Aluminum plate painted black.

I will try to get some pics tomorrow

Marty
Badger Ordnance

[stars-n-bars]

Thanks, Badgerord, I'll be looking forward to seeing them.

[Badgerord]

S-n-B

Here is a side pic of the butt
http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc162/badgerord/M40MC.jpg

Marty
Badger Ordnance

[GregV]

Was the front swivel a wood screw type like the rear, or threaded into a "nut" ?

On a side note, I just picked up a mid 80's Remington 541x, it has a rear swivel that is identical to my '43 513T and '64 40XB.

[Badgerord]

The front swivel is a machine screw and threads into a escutcheon, rear is a wood screw.

I would guess that the swivels made now are made from the same prints that Remington made them from in the 60's.

Marty
Badger Ordnance

[stars-n-bars]

Badgerord, will you post a picture of the buttplate on the stock you have? My 700P came in a plain stock like you have pictured but I'm not sure as to what the buttplate looks like. Thanks, Bob:icon_salut:

[Badgerord]

Here is a pic for now, I will try to get a pic of the back of the this weekend

http://i218.photobucket.com/albums/cc162/badgerord/M40MC.jpg

Marty
Badger Ordnance

[keith smart]

pm sent to pete

[Gus Fisher]

I can't completely speak to the sling swivels on M40's as I didn't come into the Marine RTE field until 1973 when I began my MOS 2112 OJT. They were working on the M40A1 while I was going through the one year OJT. However, it's definite the size sling swivel for the M40A1 (and most likely the M40) was so that it could be used with what most folks call the M1907 pattern leather rifle sling. We didn't call it that, rather just a "leather sling" or sometimes a "NM sling." That continued to be the issue sling throughout then to at least when I retired in Nov 1997. HTH

[Gus Fisher]

The front swivel is a machine screw and threads into a escutcheon, rear is a wood screw.

I would guess that the swivels made now are made from the same prints that Remington made them from in the 60's.

Marty
Badger Ordnance

Marty,

Sorry I missed your personal message for a while. Just got done sending you the second reply with some information for you.