Spotting scope for range shooting

[Chaz]

I'm in need of a recommendation. A few years ago my brother gave me a Bushnell 18x-36x scope for my range shooting. I have found it to be just adequate for spotting .30 cal hits on a variety of targets and inadequate for 5.56mm shooting at 100 yards. I'm tired of squinting through through it and constantly readjusting the focus. Therefore I would appreciate a suggestion as to what power of magnification you think is best for range shooting from 100-200 yards and even beyond. I'm also desiring quality optics and am willing to pay a few hundred bucks. Thanks in advance.
Bruce

[dave]

I believe a really good scope will cost more then "a few hundred bucks". The higher magnifacation will not work unless it is coupled with really HIGH quality optics. My scope cost 160 bucks or so and it is useless at 200 yards w/30 cal unless the light on target is JUST right, seldom happens!
Any thing you look at, be sure and take it out side and test at a distance, (signs, etc.) even if the sales clerk has to go with you.

[gwp]

Five years ago the Konus 80mm spotting scopes were thought to be a good value for a lower priced spotting scope. The only concerns were the lack of a waterproof rating and some reports of the mounting ring breaking. I have used this scope for casual shooting and matches and it has served well. If I had to replace the scope today it would be with a Konus 100mm scope. The 100mm cost a little over $100 more but is waterproof, has a metal body and a larger objective lens. The 80mm Korus cost $220 and the 100mm is $330.

Jim Owens reviewed the Konus 80 mm spotting scope:
http://www.jarheadtop.com/KONUS.htm

http://www.opticsplanet.net/konus-konuspot-20-60x100-spotting-scope.html
http://www.opticsplanet.net/konus-konuspot-80-80mm-3-1-spotting-scope.html

[Maury Krupp]

As with so many other things, when it come to optics "You get what you pay for."

"A couple hundred bucks" isn't going to get you much :(

But even if you buy the most expensive scope and use it on the highest magnification it isn't going to reliably show you even .30cal bullet holes much past 200yd. There is too much distortion and loss of resolution due to haze, mirage, light, and other factors.

Contrary to what many believe, in highpower competition, spotting scopes aren't used to see bullet holes. Rather their primary use is to read conditions.

The minimum *objective* size for this is generally around 50-60mm. A larger objective (up to 100-120mm) will gather more light giving a better image so bigger is better as long as quality is maintained and weight isn't a factor.

Magnification is generally around 25-30X and very often fixed rather than variable.

If your type of shooting requires you to see bullet holes and is at a distance where that's possible try using "shoot-and-see" type targets or place a reflective backer behind the target (eg, a white kitchen garbage bag draped over a second target stand).

Maury

[joem]

I've seen people use six inch telescopes for spoting scopes. Pretty large but you can see a fly at 100 yds.

[mustanggt]

I've got the Konus 80mm also. Price is right and it does the job. About 2/3 of the guys I shoot Highpower with use them. Optics planet has about the best price. Go to Jarheadtop.com for a good review of this scope. Jim sells it as well.

[Allen Humphrey]

Chaz,
I just started HP shooting last year, and not wanting to break the bank before I knew I wanted to keep doing it, I bought a NcStar 30-90x90. It goes for about 120. My goal was to be able to see .30 holes at 200 yds, which it will do except for in very low light or very heavy mirage. This allows me to practice by myself without having to walk down range so much. However, it is BIG and heavy and the image quality drops dramatically after about 45 power. The focus knob has a ton of backlash too. Much of the scope is plastic and in fact it rolled off my truck seat and onto the floor and the eyepiece broke off. Rats. Glued it back on and it still works. Good scope for the money.

I just ordered and received the Konus 80 fromJarheatop.com and used it at a match last weekend. Worked just fine. image quality is better than the NcStar but the field of view is noticeably narrower. I am wanting to compare them side by side soon.

Most people prefer the angled eyepiece.

[C5M1]

+ 1 what Maury said. Go with the angled eyepiece also.

Like the white garbage bag idea. Will give it a try next time out.


regards, dennis

[PhillipM]

I agree with Maury that past 200 and even at 200 during the heat of the day it's going to be tough to see holes. That being said, my Konus 20-60 x 80 is great except the tripod is flimsy junk. I can see .22 holes at 200 easily early in the morning.

A highpower shooter told me on the walk up and score at 200 courses they would do things like put white styrofoam sheet behind the target. He said he took some coathangers and made a frame that extended behind the target I guess about 18" at the top and attach colored fluorescent paper to the extended frame at the top and the target frame at the bottom, the idea is to catch sunlight and have it reflect through the holes. He said even a white sheet of butcher paper is helpful.

All we do is cut out the cardboard to the size of the aiming black so natural light can come through better.

[Maury Krupp]

...the tripod is flimsy junk.
This is a very important point.

If you intend to do any position shooting you're going to want a proper scope stand.

There are plenty of designs available. Which one is "best" is mostly personal preference. I like my Ray-Vin; I didn't like my Freelands.

Bottom line is, if you have to buy new, plan to add another $150-300 to your eventual "scope system" budget :icon_e_sad:

Maury

[PhillipM]

This is a very important point.

If you intend to do any position shooting you're going to want a proper scope stand.

There are plenty of designs available. Which one is "best" is mostly personal preference. I like my Ray-Vin; I didn't like my Freelands.

Bottom line is, if you have to buy new, plan to add another $150-300 to your eventual "scope system" budget :icon_e_sad:

Maury

... and that's where the Konus' rings get broken, falling over from the standing position. Make sure you get one with a firm foundation.

Chaz never said he was using it to compete in highpower, just range shooting.

[madsenshooter]

My club has these Russian scopes, the yukon 21031. They seem to be surprisingly good. I can see .243 holes at 200yds no problem, and it isn't even at full magnification at that range. Shop around and I think they can be found for around $300. Even Wally-world carries them.

[dave]

Bigger is better as far as light gathering with the objective lense, however there is a limit as far as your eyes are concerned. Once had a B&L booklet on scopes and I forget the size but with your pupil wide open, an objective lense can actually get "bigger" then your eye can take in or use. The larger size can after that point, therefore, is a waste of money! Some of these rifle scopes I see ar rediculas! Do some research on this.

[gwp]

From: http://www.singularsci.com/Accessories2.htm


“The exit pupil of an eyepiece on a particular telescope equals the diameter of the telescope’s objective divided by the magnification.”

“It would be very useful to know what is the maximum size exit pupil that you as an individual can use. This size varies from one individual to another, though it is possible to make an educated guess as to what your maximum allowable exit pupil will be. The pupils of teenagers and young adults can typically dilate to at least 7 mm. As a person gets older this maximum dilation diameter becomes gradually smaller until it reaches a lower limit. For most people this lower limit is about 5 mm. There you have it, shy away from eyepieces which will yield an exit pupil greater than 5 mm if you are age 30 or older. Everyone should avoid oculars yielding exit pupils greater than 7mm.”

Here is the published exit pupil size for several of the spotting scopes recommended.

Konus 100 Exit Pupil (mm): 5 - 1.67
Konus 80 Exit Pupil (mm): 2.9 - 1.2
Yukon Exit Pupil (mm): 4 - 1

[Chaz]

Thank you to all for your comments. Perhaps my Bushnell isn't so bad except an angled eyepiece would have been a nice feature. I definately will try using a reflective surface behind the target stand. Phillip's correct as I'm a recreational shooter and my range is 500 yards down field between two rows of almond trees behind my house. Light conditions can be poor but I can see flies clearly at 100 yards and, more than once when shooting 200 yards, I've had "guest spotters" tell me that my bullet holes were "moving." With no reflective background and good shooting in the black, they only saw the "hole" on white paper. Thanks again!
Bruce

[Johnny in Texas]

I find very nice scopes for good prices on ebay. Bausch & Lomb and Kowa these are older but great quality tripods Freeland stuff used but exell. cond. 25X to 30X is all you need 20X will work but 25X is better. My favorite old scope is a 27.5X 95MM Bausch & Lomb I bought on ebay for 125.00 with a tripod.

[Greg Ficklin]

I have been using a great scope for HP for 3 seasons now with no complaints. It is a Champions Choice ED Deluxe 60 (something) mm fixed 25X with two speed focus. When compared side by side with a Kowa 821 out to 600 yards the CC scope's brightness, and resolution were comparable to the more expensive Kowa. The only thing my CC scope gives away to the Kowa is in eye relief. This makes Kowa the best, but similar performance can be had for much less in the CC scopes at around $450. The real bang for the buck is with the Konus, but they are fragile, and not water resistant.
I believe the best all around scope for HP is the Kowa 66 with 27 LER eye piece. The light gathering of the huge objective lenses just isn't needed for shooting in broad daylight at the expense of size and weight. Life is too short to live with dark murky optics. Get a good scope and good three legged stand.

[ratter]

Konus scopes are quite good. Optics are excellent for such a low priced scope. 80mm is most popular. Kowa is an excellent high priced scope. I don't think the optics on the Kowa warrant the price difference. I own both scopes and both scopes do an excellent job. Seeing 223 holes will not pop out using a Kowa over a Konus Itialian made scope. I like my Kowa but use both scopes. The 100mm Konus is heavy and bulky and many scopeheads won't fit the 100mm Konus...Ray-vin head now sold by Creedmoor...will work. I can't see much difference between the two scopes side by side comparison at 200 or 300 yards. Kowas seem to have priced themselves out of the market for many but if you find one at a good price grab it anyway. It comes down to ..Konus is an excellent low to mid priced scope and Kowa is an excellent higher priced scope. Konus comes with zoom eye piece and Kowa you have to purchase the eye piece and the Kowa zoom is almost $300. Hi power shooters favor around 25 to 30 power.