More Gibbs 03A4

[Nate]

This is the first rifle I have ever bought without research. I was at the gun shop and had to have it. A heart attack followed with the earlier Google posts being very negative. However, this rifle is 2011 production and I can find no faults. The scope is new , marked M73G2 and has corrected all the published complaints. It is made by Malcolm Hi-Lux and it should be fine. OK, I haven't fired it yet and if there is a problem, I will report it.

[collectorm1ca]

Just a few things (which you may already know) before you take it to the range; make sure there is some relief in the wood directly behind the tang and that the action screws are tight. You will also want to check that the base screws are tightened correctly. I hope yours is as accurate as mine .

[pelago]

close friend of mine won one at perry, that was two years ago

no rifle yet, and tis is of 12 feb 2012, he won it in 2010

another friend bought one and the scope just did not move and gibbs said the scopes were not meant to be shot over 100 yards
I HEARD HIM SAY THIS OUT LOUD AT BUTNER IN HIS "CLINIC"

hope you have good luck with yours,

regards

[Nate]

I'm afraid that you might be right. I haven't fired the thing yet but in bore sighting it, I noticed that the crosshairs do not move like the M73B1. If there is a problem, Gibbs will endure a stink like they could never imagine. I'll report.

[TheMax]

in bore sighting it, I noticed that the crosshairs do not move like the M73B1

Just FYI- the earlier scopes were reported to have had the windage and elevation adjustments reversed- don`t know if this sheds any light on your observation

[pelago]

sure hope yours is resolved and works properly

me, i am not so sure about the company, they might have figured no one would shoot them and just sit on a wall also been informed that the grooves in barrel are quite light and they were actually made in italy

actions are former drill rifles with repaired cut offs on each one, and the blue does not like the metal used in repair

not impressed with the dollars one spends, heck you can make one with real pieces and parts for same dollars

[Entry Level]

The Gibbs I just took home is a shooter. 1/2 min clicks on scope, cross hair focus works. Shoots 175 SMK with 53.5 grains H-4350 just fine. Lake City Match brass. I took 1 shot at steel to check factory zero and then five at 100 yards off sand bags,


Here is an update on the new Gibbs. Went to the range and set target at 300 yards. Tested 2 loads 150 Hornady FMJ and 178 Hornady AMax. Shot the ten shots after sighter at 20 second intervals to see how difficult target acquisition would be. First target is the AMax second is the 150 FMJ. Next weekend might be able to move to 600.

[Entry Level]

So just to let everyone know the sight does not have to be shimmed to dial in 600 yards. For the current load I am shooting I need 4.5 MOA with a 100 yard 0 to shoot 300 yards. I checked my 300 yard 0 with a shot to steel and then shot a cold then warming barrel. I dialed a guess from other 06 rifles I shoot and needed 10.5 MOA to find target at 600. The first picture is a rapid 10 shot string light wind. The target is 36 inches which is the black,7 ring, on a 600 yard long range target. The white center is 6 inches round. The second target is a slower more deliberate string. The wind was increasing but I held center without spotting all shots. The dial on the Gibbs Malcom scope is 1 click per 1/2 inch so dial up from 3 to 600 was 21 clicks. I was pleased to find when I dialed back to 300 my shot was spot on. I plan to test 168 Hornady match bullets next. thanks to all....Entry Level...oh yea all the shots were in the black, a couple in the white center are hard to see.

[Entry Level]

I have included a photo of the guide to determine the width of the reticule on the Malcom scope on my Gibbs rifle. The line on the left is 1/2 inch, next 2 inches last 1 inch. I fixed the paper at 50 yards and the reticule covered the 1/2 inch stripe and fit inside the 1 inch stripe. Confirms my idea reticule is approx. 1 MOA at 100 yards. I then checked my 300 yard 0 that is 9 clicks up from 100 yards. I then dialed 21 clicks up to check 600 yard strike. Strike on an 18 inch gong. Then dialed 40 clicks up, a guess using info from my other 06's. First shot approx 50 inches low. I added 12 clicks , fired and struck 36 inch gong. Last shot was at 24 inch gong and was a strike. Then dialed down 73 clicks and first shot was on at 300 yard gong. I thoroughly shooting the Gibbs today. I am not sure the adjustment is exactly 1/2 MOA per click since this is more elevation than anything else I shoot from 100 to 1000. I can only guess it must be difficult to calibrate a knob with spring detent outside scope body. Anyway if it dials up and down to almost it works for me.I shot the 168 Hornady Match bullet today and plan to work with this for the time being.

[Entry Level]

Since I was surprised by dial up needed for 1000 yards I ran the JBM program for the bullet at 2800 fps and found the math matched real life within 1 moa. I include the results for anyone interested.

Trajectory
Input Data
Manufacturer: Hornady Description: Full Metal Jacket Boat Tail
Caliber: 0.308 in Weight: 150.0 gr
Ballistic Coefficient: 0.398 G1
Muzzle Velocity: 2800.0 ft/s Distance to Chronograph: 10.0 ft
Sight Height: 1.50 in Sight Offset: 0.00 in
Zero Height: 0.00 in Zero Offset: 0.00 in
Windage: 0.000 MOA Elevation: 0.000 MOA
Line Of Sight Angle: 10.0 deg Cant Angle: 0.0 deg
Wind Speed: 10.0 mph Wind Angle: 90.0 deg
Target Speed: 10.0 mph Target Angle: 90.0 deg
Target Height: 12.0 in
Temperature: 59.0 °F Pressure: 29.92 in Hg
Humidity: 0.0 % Altitude: 0.0 ft
Vital Zone Radius: 5.0 in
Std. Atmosphere at Altitude: No Pressure is Corrected: Yes
Zero at Max. Point Blank Range: No Target Relative Drops: Yes
Mark Sound Barrier Crossing: Yes Include Extra Rows: No
Column 1 Units: 1.00 in Column 2 Units: 1.00 MOA
Round Output to Whole Numbers: No
Output Data
Elevation: 3.662 MOA Windage: 0.000 MOA
Atmospheric Density: 0.07647 lb/ft³ Speed of Sound: 1116.4 ft/s
Maximum PBR: 332 yd Maximum PBR Zero: 283 yd
Range of Maximum Height: 157 yd Energy at Maximum PBR: 1444.3 ft•lbs
Sectional Density: 0.226 lb/in²
Calculated Table
Range Drop Drop Windage Windage Velocity Mach Energy Time Lead Lead
(yd) (in) (MOA) (in) (MOA) (ft/s) (none) (ft•lbs) (s) (in) (MOA)
0 -1.5 *** 0.0 *** 2807.9 2.515 2625.6 0.000 0.0 ***
100 0.0 0.0 0.8 0.8 2576.0 2.308 2209.7 0.112 19.6 18.7
200 -3.6 -1.7 3.5 1.6 2355.9 2.111 1848.2 0.233 41.1 19.6
300 -13.4 -4.3:hello: 8.1 2.6 2146.8 1.924 1534.8 0.367 64.5 20.5
400 -30.7 -7.3 15.1 3.6 1948.9 1.747 1264.8 0.513 90.4 21.6
500 -57.1 -10.9 24.8 4.7 1762.9 1.580 1034.9 0.675 118.9 22.7
600 -94.5 -15.0:hello: 37.5 6.0 1590.5 1.426 842.4 0.855 150.4 23.9
700 -145.5 -19.8 53.6 7.3 1434.0 1.286 684.8 1.053 185.4 25.3
800 -213.3 -25.5 73.5 8.8 1296.4 1.163 559.7 1.274 224.1 26.8
900 -301.5 -32.0 97.3 10.3 1181.4 1.060 464.8 1.516 266.9 28.3
1000 -414.4 -39.6:hello: 125.0 11.9 1091.7 0.980 396.9 1.781 313.5 29.9

the program predicts -39.6 minutes at 1000 yards. I think now an external adjustment screw can be calibrated as well as having it confirm 2 clicks per minute fo Malcom scope.

[Nate]

Since I started this I owe a range report. It took all this time to get to shoot the thing. It was a slow start. Somehow the windage knob was cranked so far to the right that even with bore sighting, the bullet strike was clear off the paper at 50yds. At the end of the day the rifle was zeroed at 300 meters with M2 ball and now I will work up a load for it. I do have a few rounds of Match ammo to experiment with. And there is nothing wrong with the scope. Mine is a later production rifle having the improved version.

[Brazos]

Entry Level, what load do you like in the LC match brass with the 168 Amax?

[pelago]

1/2 minute scope, you sure about that, none of the scopes of the era for A4's had this

sure hope you have good, hell great results, but fear that this not gonna happen

[Entry Level]

About the scope, I do not know about the true "era" values for scopes on the Springfield. . The scope on the Gibbs is surely a 1/2 minute value scope. This info is only from range testing not anything scientific. My ability regarding accuracy depends on how the targets look to me with a 2.2 power scope and reticule. My eyes prefers some targets over others and therefor produces better results. I bought the rifle for the "neat factor" and to add another 30-06 to my gear. My shooting buddy has an original but that is out of my financial ability. He is a meticulous load tester and when he mounts a different scope his rifle consistently prints 1 min.groups and better. My one military original is a BSA "T" model I have had for some time. I don't shoot these rifles when I want precision accuracy. We hope to shoot a Vintage Match and I wanted something to shoot when the Mark 1 scope on the Enfield drives me frigging crazy. Since I shoot 3 different rifles in 30-06 developing revolves around H-4350 although I might start loading with H-4831 SC for lighter loads. I have not shot the 168 A-Max just the 168 match bullet. With this bullet I load 54 grains H-4350. I try to use a powder with which I get the fullest case capacity without compressing. I will shoot a certain bullet till I can't improve accuracy and then try something different. I like the 150 FMJ with 55 grains of H-4350, this produces excellent accuracy at mid-range distances. I include a 300 yard target shot without a spotter and allowing max 20 seconds between shots, this is the 150 FMJ Hornady, The orange paster is a 3 inch square for a an aim point. The reticule practically covers the orange spot at 300 yards. A little orange peeks around the edges of the reticule. Sand bags supported the rifle. The black target is approx 18 inches across.
.

[pelago]

in a recent conversation with Parsons, (only folks i know that one could call expert on lyman) and these scopes were 1 MOA elevation and windage, no more no less

i shot mine yesterday at 300, first shot at 300 was a 9 at 7 o-clcock, had good hold and good image, came right two minutes and up two minutes. 2nd shot X at 3 o-clock, 3rd shot dead center X 4th shot ten at 9 o'clock, but i pushed it out there

shooting from a rest, 300 yard, standard target, 178 grain a max 571/2 IMR 4831 GI case winchester primer

when i retrieved target i measured the impact after scope adj and it was right on the money two minute dope change,

rifle turning out to be pretty damn good

[Gunny.b]

First I have to say that I am very impressed with your results Entry Level!

I am expecting to buy one Gibbs 03A4 very soon as I did find few here in Belgium but still affraid with the controversial reports found on the net here and there...

Entry Level what is the manufacturing date on your's? 2011?

As I want it to shoot long distance and not to stay on the wall or in a safe and the very hight price here in Belgium due to freight, import taxes and VAT charges I realy do not want to buy a bad rifle!

[Entry Level]

Gunny .b, Here is the story. When I got interested in a Gibbs I didn't know much about what I was buying. I understood Val Forget's son bought Parker-Hale and acquired 03 actions in the deal. The reproduction Gibbs was the result of him finding something to do with these parts. I don't know the manufacture date of my rifle. The scope is an M73G2 #541, this might tell someone when the rifle was assembled. It is for want of a better word "clunky". Since I bought this rifle people have showed me original Springfields and other models of original 03's that have more character. I shoot 30-06 in other rifles so having good reloading gear was a plus. I was intrigued by the rifle since it qualified for Vintage Shoots. I am not sure I would buy it again if afforded the opportunity today. It is fun in an off beat way but is not what I'd call an accurate long range shooter. The bolt lift remains heavy with all my shooting. It is safe and quaint but the scope is not to my liking. This is what we went into battle with 75 to 100 years ago and for the understanding that imparts it is good to have. The same way I enjoy shooting black powder. If you have to pay many extra charges it might be better to look at a good European battle rifle from the same period. Never the less I will take it out this weekend and shoot close and far. It is still fun to hear a friend, who might be spotting when I shoot the 24 in. gong at 1000 yards, say "outstanding".

[Gunny.b]

Entry Level, thak you very much for your explanations.

I was thinking the Gibbs A4 with his scope copy from Leatherwood may be a good altenative for a WWII rifle on long range... and I am in love with the 03's.

Your results are at least very very good for me!

My main problem still the controversial quality "reports" of these Gibbs rifles.

Seems that you may have the best as well the very bad in that production and of course I cannot test one, just having a look on the action, chamber and bore and dry fire it.

I already look inside the scope few days ago and find it perfect and very luminous for that small diameter so all good for me but don't know about setting retur to 0 and clicks possibilities and there is also a lot's of different advises on the net about these...

With all these I can't take a decision!!!