What is it? Model 1816, sort of

[hsr]

This is the results of my latest gun show fiasco. I was looking for a Model 1816 Type 2. I saw this with the type 2 swivel attachment and and the 1816 type lock plate and then sort of became fixated on trying to figure out if it was a reconversion and didn't look at any of the other details. The dealer, who shall remain nameless is semi disreputable, but I got it for a little more then half his asking price so I didn't feel I was paying too much. What I think I got is a musket assemble from semi random period parts. First thing I noticed when I got home was that the lock is dated 1837, so not a lock for a type 2, then when I hung it on the wall between my type 1 and type 3 I noticed that the stock just doesn't look right. The middle band is in the wrong spot and the drop in the butt is just wrong. So my question it; what is it from? in the picture below it is the middle one.

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p224/hsrifkin/DSC_2052.jpg

The lock is marked with a S and G and either "M.N" or "MoN".

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p224/hsrifkin/DSC_2053.jpg

Thoughts?

Thanks

Howard

[Doug Rammel]

Can't see the pics

[hsr]

Hmm.. I see them. They might just take time to load. Try the links http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p224/hsrifkin/DSC_2052.jpg and http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p224/hsrifkin/DSC_2053.jpg

[steved66]

Intriguing mystery you have there. Are there any US military cartouches on the side plate panel that would give the stock US provenance? What is the shape of the side plate; does it have the swell in the middle or is it uniformly straight and narrow? If it has the latter side plate (narrow,straight) the stock could be from a M1835 flintlock musket (sometimes called the M1840), which has a pronounced comb unlike the M1816. If it has the swelled side plate the stock could be from a late M1812 or a transitional/early M1816 musket, some of which still had the comb. In either case I don't know enough about either to explain the different position of the middle band. Is there any evidence that the stock could be from a French Model 1822, upon which the M1835 design was based?

[hsr]

Here is markings I can find on the flat opposite the lock.

http://i129.photobucket.com/albums/p224/hsrifkin/DSC_2054.jpg

It looks like it begins with an L and ends in a Y, but I can't make out the middle. It does not look like any US inspector. The side plate has a swell similar to an 1816. The butt plate is more like a 1795 then an 1812 or 1816.

[Grenadier]

Recently picked up a quite fine M1816 type 2 musket off a local Craig's List for low $ $ $. It is a later bolster percussion modification that looks to have been a very original weapon when converted. It's a SPRINGFIELD with 1823 lock date and numerous crisp inspector's marks on the wood. Was surprised to see that they actually took an earlier made M1816 and converted it in the late 1850s - early 1860s.

Will need to take a look at my 1823 type 2 musket and see where that second band is located. By remembrance, it looks to be in the same place as on yours with the other two top and bottom muskets appearing to have the second band more forward. The chief inspector's cartouche on the left side of the stock is that of a guy who served at SPRINGFIELD from 1819 - 1831 so the wood is most likely original. Will have to look a little later.