03A3 bbl/front sight question

[GregU]

I picked up a sporterized 03A3 to use for a fake 03A4 build. This is a Rem 3,379,xxx receiver with a 1-43 stamped RA bbl. The rifle had been started toward a build before so the front sight was included but off. All the pics I've seen of snipers show the front sight longitudinal groove and 2 wide cross grooves. This rifle I have just has a longitudinal groove w/key. The front sight was ( I think ) a 1903 sight and the cross pin was drilled through the center of the dovetail/dovetail base/key on the front sight. Doesn't look like there was ever a cross pin hole in the rear of the sight base like I've normally seen. So, why no cross grooves?.

[chuckindenver]

pictures.

[GregU]

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e353/coyotewillie/P1010007_zps7b9d17b4.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e353/coyotewillie/P1010008_zpsbd30f619.jpg

[4F4Nam]

I'll admit to grabbing at straws here but,.......... left over/converted/replacement '03 barrel????????

Ed

[chuckindenver]

kinda..
a few early 1903A3s were fitted with left over 1903 Remington barrels...
how bout a pic of the chamber area...id bet its cut for a rear sight base.
iv seen a couple like this over the years..
or, since this is a sporter, could just be a 1903 barrel that was installed on a 1903A3 by a gunsmith.

[GregU]

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e353/coyotewillie/P1010010_zps29bae776.jpg

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e353/coyotewillie/P1010009_zps18f04569.jpg

[chuckindenver]

yes, 1903 barrel used up stock..barrel is likely original to the action.

[GregU]

OK, that's probably a negative then on using this bbl? I don't know if you can see it in the picture, but this has me worried too. Slight heat ring on the front of the receiver. Looks like they heated the receiver to tap the front mount. That can't be good, can it?

http://i43.photobucket.com/albums/e353/coyotewillie/P1010011_zpsad52212e.jpg

[chuckindenver]

i have serveral later A3 barrels available., would take that barrel in trade..heat shouldnt be an issue...the holes drilled for a Weaver base is a bigger issue.

[Darreld Walton]

Greg, I am looking at my own rifle with same front sight arrangement, also with a 1-43 barrel date. Mine, though, has been machined into the A3 configuration at the chamber end. I've owned several rifles with the unfinished rear fixed sight base "pad", as yours, but they all had the "normal" A3 front sight base, key, and slots. Years back, in fact, back when there was Culver's and "Gun and Knife" 03 forums, (does posting back then make me a REALLY Old Fart?), there was a fellow I know up in Fairbanks who posted as "Dave in AK", who also reported a barrel assembly identical to yours, but I don't recall what his s/n was, and his report stirred a fairly good-sized kettle at the time!
There apparently was a LOT of "floor sweepings" that were cycled into production, and apparently not necessarily in one 'set' of serial numbers. The one on my desk at the moment with the 1-43 barrel date is s/n 3,516,244, and the barrel and receiver finish is a dead on match, with no evidence of being assembled, disassembled, re-assembled, or screwed with after it left the manufacturer. The A3's with the unfinished chamber ends that I owned, IIRC, were in the neighborhood of 3,37X,XXX.
I'd personally be inclined to leave the assembly as-is, put the front sight back on, of course, with photo documentation, and send a PM to John Beard.

I'd also just put filler screws into the 6-48 holes you have, and perhaps shop for another rifle. As Chuck mentioned, yours is drilled and tapped for a Weaver, or other two-piece base setup, and they will NOT align with the Redfield base you need for an A4 "tribute" rifle. There is most likely room for what would be a third hole, at the rear of the two in the front ring, to accommodate the 8-40 screw for the Redfield, but then, you'd need to index that hole off the hole in the rear bridge, which also would need to be enlarged and re-threaded to 8-40...........

[jgaynor]

To Chuck and Darrelds comments the attached pics illustrate where the A4 rcvr was drilled and where the mounting screw was located

Regards,
Jim

2208022081

[chuckindenver]

Leupold bases are made to fit Weavers if they are drill in the right place...
this one is too far foward. will need some gunsmith love to work right

[GregU]

Well, there's not too much of this looking very positive! I took a chance on this hoping I could make it work. Now it doesn't look good. The rear hole will work right now....with a 6-48 screw, but not sure if a 8-40 will line up. Looks like my last 2 deals on rifles aren't turning out too well, LOL. Anyway, is there anything salvageable on this? Thanks. Greg

[Darreld Walton]

Well, there's not too much of this looking very positive! I took a chance on this hoping I could make it work. Now it doesn't look good. The rear hole will work right now....with a 6-48 screw, but not sure if a 8-40 will line up. Looks like my last 2 deals on rifles aren't turning out too well, LOL. Anyway, is there anything salvageable on this? Thanks. Greg

YES!!! Very much so, in fact! Every once in awhile, even a blind dog finds a bone! Your barrel is uncommon with a very large, capitalized, U! Not worth enough to pay off the mortgage, but interesting in the least, and most likely worth more than you might consider to someone who needs one to fill a 'hole' in a collection. The receiver is worth converting to a nice sporter, and that's nothing to sneeze at, either, as drilling and tapping holes can range up to $50 per hole, on top of the cost of the receiver, were you to start with one, new, and it seems that the work was done neatly and accurately. It may be that the Leupold one piece base might line up, but if it doesn't, I'd bet the Weavers will, and either one is a solid setup. The Leupold and Weaver both use size 6-48 screws, the Leupold two up front, the Redfield uses one size 8-40 up front and in the rear. If drilled accurately to start with in the rear, all you'd have to do is open it up to the proper size and re-thread, but the new hole up front goes right through the buttress of the top recoil lug at the rear of the forward receiver ring.
To make a fairly accurate A4 these days, you've just about got to start with one that's had the Redfield one piece "Jr" installed, or have one installed onto a virgin, which is why most guys start with a drill rifle receiver instead of drilling an unaltered piece.
To Mr. Gaynor, you posted nice photos of your Z prefix A4, and Redfield base, I couldn't dig out the photos of any of My own A4's and appreciate you posting yours! I've contemplated altering at least a couple of receivers drilled and tapped just like Greg's to fit an original Redfield, but in the end, decided not to, as I didn't figure that I needed three holes in the top of the front ring.

[John Beard]

Since my response has been solicited, I will offer the following.

In December, 1942, Remington began phasing out M1903 production and phasing in M'03-A3 production. The phase-in/phase-out period lasted more than two months. As the M'03-A3 began to dominate production, Remington began fitting leftover M1903 parts onto M'03-A3's. Nothing went to waste! By S/N 3379739, very few M1903's remained to be assembled. So, the remaining unfinished M1903 barrels and front sights were fitted to M'03-A3's. The rifle in the pictures is not unusual in the least. About 10,000-15,000 such M'03-A3 rifles with various blends of mixed barrels and sights were assembled.

Hope this helps.

J.B.