View Full Version : This guy is a crook.
He's found out that he can buy a reproduction M1910 bayonet scabbard from What Price Glory for about $40.00 and sell them for several hundred. Here's two links to his current auction and the one where he just sold another yesterday.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCARCE-ORIGINAL-M1905-US-BAYONET-SCABBARD-EXCELLENT-UNISSUED-CONDITION-/380734880278
http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCARCE-ORIGINAL-M1905-US-BAYONET-SCABBARD-EXCELLENT-UNISSUED-CONDITION-/290985340165?_trksid=p2047675.l2557&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEWAX%3AIT&nma=true&si=jShYqvS7GZG9eFrPL6fOPGBhMKU%253D&orig_cvip=true&rt=nc
Here are two links to WPG's site with the same scabbard. They DO seem to be good scabbards though.
http://onlinemilitaria.net/shopdisplayproducts.asp?id=134&cat=SCABBARDS+%26+KNIVES
http://onlinemilitaria.net/shopexd.asp?id=801&bc=no
Fred,
Are you sure? How can you tell the difference?
I can't stand these reproductions!!!!
Clay
Clay, the narrower swell at the throat of the scabbard as opposed to the wider swell on an authentic one, the look and color and condition of the leather tip as well as the webbing, the way he immediately obtained another such scabbard after selling the previous one, the way some advance collectors stayed away from the first and this 2nd scabbard even when the scabbards are basically in pristine condition. My gut feeling on top of it all too. I ordered one of these scabbards from WPG just the other day for $40.00 though because they Are really nice and are very superior in quality to any other reproduction M1910 scabbard on the market. All of the others are extremely cheaply made. I think that most people are catching onto this guys sales as they aren't jumping on this scabbard as fast as the previous one. It's a good thing to know what you are collecting if you're going to spend big money on it. One fellow who had put in the winning bid of $178.00 on an obviously phony M1905 RIA bayonet the other day that sells for $40.00, was one of the guys who tried to buy the first repro scabbard for big bucks. Whoever he is, he has no experience with the subject at all and is the sort of guy who crooks take advantage of. Sad.
Thanks Fred. I hate repros.........being sold as originals.
Clay
That particular type of repro isn't available anymore right now. Not that brand anyway that was made for WPG to retail out. THE owner of the company told me yesterday that he still has the scabbard with the Pea Green material or webbing that has a narrower and non authentic gage of wire hanger. It too is of better quality than the others of that type that are pure crap. However, it's sad to see somebody put out $280.00 or more on a repro scabbard that sells for $40.00 that they are led to believe is an original scabbard. I just bought an original M1910 for $198.00 that is pretty nice. it's not here yet, but it's the early type with the brass tube sewn in the flap that the hanger wire goes through. The webbing is immaculate and the leather and threading intact. Yea, I had to pay good money for it, but it'll keep appreciating in value. I got it on Gun Broker and needed it to harbor a nice bayonet that I bought recently too. I'll post a photo of the bayonet on my 1903 tomorrow on this thread.
Fred, with all due respect but what is the difference if some one buys a bayonet and scabbard at an estate auction for $45.00 and sells it for $300. I have done this several time but they all have been original and not reproductions. Now, I see he is not calling the scabbard a reproduction but original. This can be reported to Ebay. Just send Ebay the link to WPG. The price is not a factor.
Well, the point that I was making was that he is selling a reproduction bayonet scabbard that goes for $45.00 (no, the price doesn't matter, it's a repro) as an original scabbard. OK the fact that he sold the last $45.00 reproduction scabbard for $280.00 is just fuel on the fire. It's a shame that some guys bid on it because they thought that he was being honest. They thought that they were bidding on a really nice, cherry scabbard. Some poor guy out bid everyone else and won it. He will send in his hard earned money for it thinking that he was told the truth by the seller who admittedly, might believe himself that the scabbard is original. However it's suspicious that upon selling the last repro scabbard, the seller immediately, within minutes, put up another identical repro scabbard again, claiming that it too is an original scabbard. The buyers will show them off at a gun show or might even try to sell them now for a profit and they might be corrected if they're lucky or they might sell them to some other unsuspecting guys who will put out even more money for them thinking that they've got a real gem for their collection now.
Of course it doesn't matter what amount of profit anyone makes on an item that they sell. That's called Capitalism. That wasn't my point. It DOES matter though that the item they are selling as an original is a reproduction and they KNOW it.
My purpose in posting the auctions was to let everyone here see them and be aware of them so that they didn't get cheated if they decided to buy a scabbard from this guy.
Oh, here is my newly acquired and little used SA 1918 bayonet on an 03 Springfield of mine that has also been used and handled Very little from the day it left Springfield Armory in mid 1918. I thought that they make a good pair. Just something nice to leave one of my as yet unborn grand children some day.
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c72/Whitedog333/rifleampbayonet2_zps94d68db6.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/Whitedog333/media/rifleampbayonet2_zps94d68db6.jpg.html)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c72/Whitedog333/rifleampbayonet3_zps3ab3a36a.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/Whitedog333/media/rifleampbayonet3_zps3ab3a36a.jpg.html)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c72/Whitedog333/rifleampbayonet5_zpsd3d59263.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/Whitedog333/media/rifleampbayonet5_zpsd3d59263.jpg.html)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c72/Whitedog333/rifleampbayonet4_zpscf91094b.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/Whitedog333/media/rifleampbayonet4_zpscf91094b.jpg.html)
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c72/Whitedog333/rifleampbayonet1_zps797e2d95.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/Whitedog333/media/rifleampbayonet1_zps797e2d95.jpg.html)
I just like this picture, so I'm posting it...
http://i25.photobucket.com/albums/c72/Whitedog333/TOUCHSMART-HP/Pictures/springfield-2_zpsa8fcc061.jpg (http://s25.photobucket.com/user/Whitedog333/media/TOUCHSMART-HP/Pictures/springfield-2_zpsa8fcc061.jpg.html)
Very nice rifle and bayonet....l like that photo to.
Dollar Bill
10-08-2013, 10:11
I just like this picture, so I'm posting it...
Thanks for posting, Fred.
Very nice rifle and bayonet....l like that photo to.
Thanks. Yea, it's a good photo isn't it?
Thanks for posting, Fred.
My pleasure! I really liked it the moment I saw it.
Has the blade been blued sometime in its life or was there a date/time when blueing blades started? I only own one but have seen many others---bright blades.
Rick the Librarian
10-09-2013, 06:59
IIRC, M1905 bayonets were blued in the 1914-1917 period and then Parkerized after that (including bayonets sent in for overhaul from earlier periods.
Here's a couple of pictures of one of my pre-WWI bayonets. Note the blued "band" near the crosspiece and markings.
http://www.fototime.com/AFA6ACF24D3E069/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/964015811CB4C11/standard.jpg
http://www.fototime.com/1506C1177AB88BE/standard.jpg
That's a really Nice M1905 (updated to 1910) scabbard Rick. The bayonet ain't bad either!
Here is an example (in the link below) of an original M1910 scabbard that is pretty nice and comes with a somewhat worn 1905 bayonet. Although the webbing of the scabbard has shrunk in length after being wet. The web cover can be stretched back out again easily by first taking it off of the scabbard body (they were made to do that for cleaning purposes) and then wetting it down, being careful Not to wet the leather in the process. Then the web cover can have the excess water soaked up using a towel and then placing it back onto the body, the web cover should be stretched by continually pulling it lengthways from the base to the throat between the thumb and fingers. Once the proper length of the webbing is achieved, it should be occasionally stretched in the same manner as it continues to dry.
This scabbard alone is worth the opening bid on this auction (no, I have nothing to do with this auction). It's amazing to me that such items are ignored by many who will errantly seek out and buy a reproduction scabbard... sometimes with a reproduction bayonet too, all for a lot more money, while thinking that they're buying something genuine. It really does pay to get out and look at all sorts of original stuff as well as reproductions. Then, the obvious differences between the two will be easily noticed.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/US-Army-WW1-1918-SA-Springfield-Armory-16-Bayonet-with-Scabbard-/111184290639
aptech77
10-09-2013, 12:38
removed
!
My oh my! Yet another "original" one he's selling that's in the same brand new condition. Identical with the other two. And, there will most certainly be buyers bidding it up to between $200.00 and $300.00 like the last two I've noticed he's sold. I don't know if the seller sold any others before these last three, but Gosh, he's certainly taking advantage of P.T. Barnum's saying about" There's a Sucker Born Every Minute".
The seller must've bought a bunch of them from WPG because when I tried to buy one from Jerry, who owns the company, he told me that he was all sold out for awhile and had more on order. Oh well, when I Do buy one or two to fit my scabbardless 1905 bayonet's in, I'll only have to pay the $42.00 or so that WPG is asking for them. They ARE very well made scabbards. I won't be trying to age them or pass them off as originals. If some folks want to pay $300.00 for one, that's their business I suppose. Sigh...
http://www.ebay.com/itm/ORIGINAL-M1905-US-WWI-BAYONET-SCABBARD-UNISSUED-CONDITION-/190939255392?&_trksid=p2056016.l4276
I've inquired of this seller as to the "originality" of his item:
Dear 1961dwayne,
Wow! Bannermans! I thought all his stuff was rotted and mildewed by now. This is original US Army manufacture, not a reproduction? How can I descern that? What part of what picture demonstrates the originality? Thanks!
ClaudeH [Here, I have substituted my name on this forum vs. on e-Bay]
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Dear ClaudeH [Here, I have substituted my name on this forum vs. on e-Bay],
?
- 1961dwayne
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Dear 1961dwayne,
Your answer is a question mark?
Please point out features in your photos that will help me distinguish your original sheath from the very good reproductions that are being made.
- ClaudeH [Here, I have substituted my name on this forum vs. on e-Bay]
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Dear ClaudeH [Here, I have substituted my name on this forum vs. on e-Bay],
leather scabbard tip and stitching, brass web belt attachment, cloth material and stitching, examine the other photos also.
- 1961dwayne
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1961dwayne,
Yes, but the reproductions have all of those features. How can you demonstrate the originality of your item versus being a reproduction?
ClaudeH [Here, I have substituted my name on this forum vs. on e-Bay]
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He really doesn't care to address his claim of originality head-on, does he? His answers strike me as purposely evasive.
If he responds to my third inquiry, I'll let you know.
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Someone ought to start a web-site that is an index of apparently fraudulent online sales. Since e-Bay doesn't reveal bidders or allow others to contact them anymore, a person could scan the index to check out ths lerrer generally or comments like this thread about specific items.
That's mighty interesting Claude! I appreciate you doing that. The guy is a shifty one and I'll bet won't stop putting even more of the scabbards up for auction after this one sells. The lure of easy money seems too much of a temptation for him what with him getting back 7 to 8 times his investment of $48.00 or so in each scabbard. Hopefully, our discussing the issue here on this forum will warn some people away from buying from him. Thanks again!
F.G.
OOps! The guy selling the third reproduction scabbard is a different guy from the guy who sold the first two. Gee, maybe this guy is trying to unload one that he got stuck with or is trying to make a fast buck like the first guy. Interesting how he chose to use a red cloth back drop in some of his photos like the first guy did.
Rick the Librarian
10-26-2013, 06:43
[[SIZE=2]Someone ought to start a web-site that is an index of apparently fraudulent online sales. Since e-Bay doesn't reveal bidders or allow others to contact them anymore, a person could scan the index to check out ths lerrer generally or comments like this thread about specific items.
A good idea, but could you imagine the legal complications and "points of view"? I doubt we'll ever see it happen.
Oh yeah, there would be legal implications. Outright slams like "This guy's a crook" or "Kriger [sic] is shady" would be risky behavior. But straightforward descriptions of what you saw and why it created doubts in your mind, along with appropriate caveats about not having seen it in person, etc. ought to sail. Maybe?
It's along the lines of another reporting service I've always wanted to start: A legal hazards reporting service. For instance if someone reported to the service that a certain store had a large lighted sign on a pylon that was severely rusted at the bottom and likely to soon topple, possible injuring someone - The service would forward the complaint to the property owner and then make a complete entry of the complaint and the facts of forwarding it to the property owner on such and such a date. If someone was injured the negligent party would be pretty defenseless. You would pay for this by charging a hefty subscription price to lawyers! Besides the social justice aspects, there's something about the sound of 'charging lawyers hefty fees' that just warms my heart!
Dear ClaudeH [Here, I have substituted my name on this forum vs. on e-Bay],
That's all I can give you. If you're not comfortable with this scabbard, please do not bid.
thanks,
Dwayne
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