Remington 1903 New Zealand Lend Lease

[gfguns]

Hello all
I am looking for opinions regarding rarity and value of a Remington 1903 New Zealand Lend Lease in mint condition with a 1923 sling. Thank You in advance for your help.
Greg

[Mike D]

If it is an early rifle with a finger groove stock, your getting close to $1,500, my opinion.

Do you own the rifle? Photos?

Mike

[John Beard]

Seasons' Greetings!

The rifles are not rare. Over 20,000 were issued and the survival rate is reasonable. A mint specimen should fetch $1500-$2000. But prices have softened over the last 12 months, so it may not fetch that much.

Hope this helps. Happy New Year!

J.B.

[Kragrifle]

The last one on GB sold right at $2000. Very difficult rifle to find.

[gfguns]

Thanks Mike D. I don't have pictures yet but I will post some ASAP. Yes it does have the grasping grooves and I believe the serial # begins with 303. The rifle is like new with just a couple small dents in the stock. The wood appears as though it has not been handled at all and the markings RLB, sub inspector marks and New Zealand markings are very well struck and crisp. I think it will take $2,500.00 to 3k to buy this rifle and I agree that sounds pricey but I have not been able to find many for sale the last year or so and I have seen none available in this condition. I will report back when I know more. Thanks again for your help


If it is an early rifle with a finger groove stock, your getting close to $1,500, my opinion.

Do you own the rifle? Photos?

Mike

[gfguns]

Same to you and yours John. I hope the seller is watching this thread because he has his sights set a bit higher. Thank You for your time and the information John

Greg

Seasons' Greetings!

The rifles are not rare. Over 20,000 were issued and the survival rate is reasonable. A mint specimen should fetch $1500-$2000. But prices have softened over the last 12 months, so it may not fetch that much.

Hope this helps. Happy New Year!

J.B.

[gfguns]

Thank You Kragrifle. do you recall the condition on that one?

Greg


The last one on GB sold right at $2000. Very difficult rifle to find.

[Emri]

Same to you and yours John. I hope the seller is watching this thread because he has his sights set a bit higher. Thank You for your time and the information John

Greg

If JB re-reads this thread and sees that the rifle has a GG stock, he might re-think his estimates. Are you sure the SN is 3,030,000 or 3,003,000. I have a 3,008,000 Remington with the GG stock. The stock is not "mint" and the rifle itself is a restoration to "correct" status. I paid $1500 for it and considered that a "good deal".

Pictures if you can !!


FWIW,

Emri

[Rick the Librarian]

One of the finest Remington M1903 rifles with grasping grooves is in the 3,030,000 range. I have seen legitimate gg stocks on Remingtons well into the 3,040,000 range.

http://www.fototime.com/109A3808EF29E50/standard.jpg

[gfguns]

Thanks Emri. The serial number of the rifle is 3032228 and I should have pictures tomorrow at the latest.

Rick that is a nice looking Red Star. Mine is in the 3,04 range and does not have the gg stock. Why are the gg rifles more desirable and what kind of premium do they command? BTW do you still refer to these as Red Stars? If not what do you call them?

Thanks for your help Emri and Rick

Greg

[Rick the Librarian]

The GG stocks (if the correct RLB-marked ones) command a higher price, simply because there weren't that many made out of the total group of @ 348,000 Remington M1903s. I would estimate at most, maybe 10-15% had GG stocks. Out of those, think of all the ones that were lost, overhauled, etc. and I don't think it is too hard to figure out why correct GG Remington M1903s command a significant premium.

Yes, I do refer to the 200 or so rifles imported by Will Levin as "Red Star" rifles. It is obviously a "generic" name and not really correct, since only about 70 or so were really sold by the Red Star Gunshop.

[John Beard]

If JB re-reads this thread and sees that the rifle has a GG stock, he might re-think his estimates. Are you sure the SN is 3,030,000 or 3,003,000. I have a 3,008,000 Remington with the GG stock. The stock is not "mint" and the rifle itself is a restoration to "correct" status. I paid $1500 for it and considered that a "good deal".

Pictures if you can !!


FWIW,

Emri

Seasons' Greetings!

If the question had been posed a year ago, I would have given a higher estimate. But mid-range collectible M1903 prices have softened over the past 12 months. I've seen some real bargains go down, including some exceptionally nice Remingtons.

I acknowledge that some of the commercial auction houses have been able to fetch good money in many cases. But even their prices have softened and have become very much hit and miss. I attribute the softening to a sustained sour economy. Just my opinion.

Happy New Year!

J.B.

[Kragrifle]

But Mr. Obama says we are "doing fine"!

[rebound]

What's the opinion on this one?
Serial #3016811 all R marked but no ORD. or RLB stamp.
And it doesn't look like it was sanded off.
http://i.imgur.com/3WQmNJE.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/8ffeDzh.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/VRaFj3B.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/ddMmRtm.jpg
http://i.imgur.com/vmXbYKS.jpg

[rebound]

Sorry about the big pics,,, but the grandson is teaching me how to load pics... At least you won't have to inlarg'em. LOL

[Fred]

How about a photo of the entire rifle.

[Rick the Librarian]

The markings look like a Remington stock. I saw another rifle in the 3,004,000 range, also lacking the inspection stamp, but otherwise complete.

[gfguns]

I did not get the rifle tonight, pictures as soon as I do

[gfguns]

Here it is

http://i39.tinypic.com/2a8jksm.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/2jeoe2d.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/idym12.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/2m4defk.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/20pq4iv.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/2n6q8k.jpg
http://i42.tinypic.com/sndliv.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/29m998k.jpg
http://i40.tinypic.com/347zcjb.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/206o5lf.jpg

[gfguns]

More
http://i39.tinypic.com/293f2ax.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/2ds0nr4.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/30ka9ur.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/2nlcy93.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/2ajqmpw.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/2gt45le.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/2edpdkx.jpg
http://i44.tinypic.com/viel4g.jpg
http://i41.tinypic.com/6q9l6b.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/15zo0so.jpg

[gfguns]

One more

http://i43.tinypic.com/15gxwyb.jpg

[Rick the Librarian]

Excellent - looks like a real beaut!! Looks like it did have the RLB stamp, after all.

[Emri]

Very Nice !! Thanks for the pics.

Does your bolt shroud have a middle detent for the safety or just the detents at safe and fire ??

Thanks again,

Emri

[gfguns]

Thanks Rick I am very pleased with it, although it may take a few years for it to grow into what I paid.


Excellent - looks like a real beaut!! Looks like it did have the RLB stamp, after all.

[gfguns]

Hi Emri
It does have the third detent

[http://i41.tinypic.com/doxh94.jpg
http://i39.tinypic.com/261nf2g.jpg

QUOTE=Emri;347888]Very Nice !! Thanks for the pics.

Does your bolt shroud have a middle detent for the safety or just the detents at safe and fire ??

Thanks again,

Emri[/QUOTE]

[Emri]

Thanks gfguns. I couldn't see it in the other pics and can't remember when JB told me they eliminated it. I was curious if your 30,000 rifle had it or not. I spent quite a while before I found one for my 8,000 rifle and when I found it it was in another rifle. Looking for one is like hunting for chicken lips.

Thanks again,

Emri

[John Beard]

...is like hunting for chicken lips.

Thanks again,

Emri

Chickens now have fingers and Buffalo have wings. Surely it's only a matter of time until you find chicken lips!

J.B. :hello:

[Kragrifle]

Droooool!

[Kragrifle]

My 3006827 does not have the middle detent. Anyway this is original? Rest of my rifle looks OK.

[gfguns]

John, Emri or Rick may know but I don't. I was just made aware there was a difference a couple days ago.


My 3006827 does not have the middle detent. Anyway this is original? Rest of my rifle looks OK.

[Rick the Librarian]

The "middle detent" bolt sleeve was used until later in production than the 3,006,000 range, I believe. Checked my two "Red Star" Remingtons, 3,024,801 and 3,051,437 and both of them have it.

[John Beard]

Thanks Rick I am very pleased with it, although it may take a few years for it to grow into what I paid.

While I perhaps may have valued your rifle a bit less than what you paid for it, I readily acknowledge that you have a very splendid rifle! I am reminded of the wise advice once rendered herein, "You can't pay too much. You can only buy too soon!" And I believe that advice applies here. Your rifle may not now be worth what you paid for it, but it soon will be! You did well! Thanks for sharing!

J.B.

[John Beard]

My 3006827 does not have the middle detent. Anyway this is original? Rest of my rifle looks OK.

While it's possible that your rifle's bolt sleeve might be original to it, the statistical odds are low. Certainly the sleeve is not contemporary with the serial number. The sleeve is more likely a later replacement.

Hope this helps.

J.B.

[gfguns]

Thanks John I understand and I agree with that logic.

While I perhaps may have valued your rifle a bit less than what you paid for it, I readily acknowledge that you have a very splendid rifle! I am reminded of the wise advice once rendered herein, "You can't pay too much. You can only buy too soon!" And I believe that advice applies here. Your rifle may not now be worth what you paid for it, but it soon will be! You did well! Thanks for sharing!

J.B.

[JimF]

The "middle detent" bolt sleeve was used until later in production than the 3,006,000 range, I believe. Checked my two "Red Star" Remingtons, 3,024,801 and 3,051,437 and both of them have it.

. . . . . as does my 3,019,609 (Feb. 1942) w/ 1-42 barrel. --Jim

[Tom Doniphon]

Up to about what serial number range is the middle detent bold sleeve found?

[Rick the Librarian]

I have it on my 3,051,000 range original rifle.