Remington Rand 1911a1 with NO serial number

[M1bear1942]

Hello everyone. I need a lil help. There is a gentleman out here in west Texas I know. He got this 1911 from his uncle that used it as his truck gun while out in the oil field for 20 plus years. He has had it himself for the past 15-20 years since his uncle passed.

It has the United States Property and M1911A1 U.S. Army stamps on the receiver and that's all. No proof P's, no inspector marks, and no serial number. I took the slide apart and there is also NO serial number stamped around the firing pin hole.

The coloring is the green park that is on one of my '42 Garands. There is no sign of welding or grinding around the receiver, and no marks to make me think it was a discarded frame.

I need opinions and possibly explanations.

Pics: http://s384.photobucket.com/user/m1bear1942/slideshow/1911a1%20Rem%20Rand

Thanks,
Bear

[citizenkane]

Could it be a lunch box pistol?
Seems quite possible.

[Chris W.]

Sure could be a lunch box pistol, or one made from a discarded frame that was somehow out of spec. Shouldn't be a problem though, SN wasn't required by the ATF on all firearms until 1968 and I'm sure that one was made well before that date. Shoot it and enjoy. Lots of machined parts are scrapped because they don't gage as a "pass" at one stage or another, this could well be one of them. Doesn't mean it can't be made into a working pistol, in fact a well working one.
Chris

[M1bear1942]

Any explanations as to why it's got the property marks but no proofs? I thought they stamped them all at once....

He's asking 2000 for it. Falls around the 95-98% price in the blue book.

[Mike Josephic]

If the pistol has no serial number, then it would be an issue to legally transfer it to you. If guns of that period were not serial
numbered (antique, over 100 years old) then that's a different story. However, these WW II gun WERE all serial numbered.
I personally would steer clear of this purchase as it could bring you nothing but trouble. It MAY be a "lunch box special" or
maybe a fake with the number ground off -- how would you know? In either case, it's illegal.

I'm a C&R license holder and that's just my opinion. This pistol falls into the C&R category (50 years old or older but not antique).

Mike

[PhillipM]

He lives in a free state with no FFL transfer needed.

[citizenkane]

For that price I would look elsewhere

[Scott Gahimer]

I sure don't see $2K worth of pistol there, based on condition alone. The blemishes in the finish don't look like standard wear patterns. Photos aren't good enough to offer an opinion on whether or not it originally had a serial number. But even if it didn't, it's not a $2K to me.

[Johnny P]

The pistol does look like one that someone stole before it was completed, possibly as parts. It would seem to be a big hassle, but the BATF will attempt to authenticate pistols with no serial number as being original. This could also result in losing the pistol unless there is sufficient evidence to show that it just never was serialized.

The 1968 Gun Law required that all newly manufactured firearms have a serial number, but it didn't exempt those made before that time from having a serial number removed. The Federal Firearms Act of 1938 made it a federal crime to alter or remove a firearms serial number.

[chuckindenver]

any weapon that had a serial number no matter what time or date it was made...
alter of a serial number is a felony...no grey area ..
you can see the ghost of the serial if you look close.
gun is not legal to have...plain and simple..and might get you a free ride in a police car.

[Johnny P]

And by the same logic your reading the thread on the pistol makes you an accessory.

[Johnny P]

Learn that M1bear1942 is a very common name in west Texas, and they will never find him. That you Forrest?