Krag at Cabelas

[psteinmayer]

Saw an 1894 rifle at Cabelas in Dundee Michigan today. Serial number (if I remember it correctly) was 15613 or 13615... something like that. It looked pretty good, with a sharp 1898 cartouche and proof mark. The barrel had decent rifling, but was very dirty. 1896 rear sight. Everything seemed to be correct and functioned well. Price was $849.99. I would have tried to have it follow me home, but the wife was with me, so that would have placed me squarely in divorce court, LOL!

[madsenshooter]

I think you mistook a 5 for an 8 on the cartouche. 1898 was a little late for putting 92s together. One of mine is close to 13615, 13076 is the receiver I have with cracks behind the locking lug recess.

[psteinmayer]

That may be... I was trying to go from memory. Cabelas tend to frown on you taking pictures of the guns they are selling!

[DRAGONFLYDF]

2 words, LAY AWAY

[psteinmayer]

I would love to do Lay Away... but I'm betting the wife would figure it out, and put the ky-bosch on it! Hmmmmm - I must give this a little further thought!

[Ken The Kanuck]

My wife knows that I have guns. That is enough. Past that there is no "need to know" as we are all aware that the "devil is in the details", give her more details and she will surely raise devil.

KTK

[Rick the Librarian]

Another possibility is that the 1898 inspection stamp was just that and the stock was a replacement. If the stock was an 1895, look on the bottom of the forestock and there should be a filled-in groove which was used for the cleaning rod on the original Model 1892.

The rifle would be a 1892/96 is so-described.

[psteinmayer]

If I get back there this week, I'll take a look at that Rick. I'll also try to sneak a picture or two...

[Ned Butts]

Another possibility is that the 1898 inspection stamp was just that and the stock was a replacement.
A stock with an original bolt handle cut out for a 92 and 96 with an original 1898 cartouch would be a fairly rare bird and likely worth the price of the whole rifle. With aprox. 20,000 Model 96 rifles made in 1898 before the switch over and factoring in field damage and sporterizing, one in original condition could be quite rare. IHO

[Dick Hosmer]

Apparently it has been sold?

FWIW, I have found Cabelas to have one of the least user-friendly sites in the entire collector arena, especially for military arms - to the point that I just don't bother to go there very often. Add in their ridiculously high prices and looking-down-their-nose attitude, there's not a lot to like.

[psteinmayer]

Well, I'll try to get back there sometime this week, and check it out. If I remember right, the stock DID have the scalloped bolt handle cutout, as opposed to the 1898 square cut. The more I think about it... the more I think I should have stolen the checkbook out of my wife's purse and just dealt with her later, LOL.

[madsenshooter]

Just use charger money! LOL! Honey, it's my work! It's probably gone already anyway. I know right where that Cabelas is located, drove past more than once on my way to and from Washtenaw.

[psteinmayer]

I'm going to venture there on Wednesday just to see if it's still there... but it's probably not. When ever I go there, I check out the library just to see what is in there. Sometimes there's an interesting rifle. sometimes, there's junk being passed off as legitimate! Saw an 1898 cutoff sporter once being passed off as a legitimate 1898 carbine, and WAYYYYYYY over priced!

FWIW Bob, I saw a Madsen there last time too!

[Rick the Librarian]

Their rifles online are usually grossly overpriced and under-described. And good luck trying to get any questions answered.

[Mark Daiute]

My wife knows that I have guns. That is enough. Past that there is no "need to know" as we are all aware that the "devil is in the details", give her more details and she will surely raise devil.

KTK

I lived on the edge with strategies like this with my first wife. Had to. I've only lied to my second wife once. She indulges me desires/hobies even when she should say "no".

[psteinmayer]

Unfortunately, being out of work... my wife pretty much says no to everything these days. The exception right now is I can compete in my matches, but she is even giving me the evil eye about that!

[psteinmayer]

Back to Cabelas today to pick up a couple things... and found that 1894 hidden behind a few other older toys. Here's what I saw:

1894, Serial number 15619. Decent 1895 cartouche. Sharp proof mark, but appears to have been struck twice with the sharp mark about 1/8 inch off what may or may not be a first mark. 1896 rear sight. Rifle looks to be a good condition, with a decent bore... but it's dirty too, and could use a good cleaning. Price is still $849.99.

[Rick the Librarian]

Did it have the filled in channel for a cleaning rod?

[madsenshooter]

If not, run back and buy it, you'll make out like a bandit.

[psteinmayer]

I saw no hole or channel for the cleaning rod. It did have the butt trap, but it was empty. I would love to go back and buy it. I think it's a steal anyway... The only thing stopping me is the lack of money!

[Dick Hosmer]

Did it have the filled in channel for a cleaning rod?

It wouldn't, because it is a thick-wrist stock. All 1896 changes and then some (stock) seem to have been applied. A fair price perhaps, but no raging steal. That only happens every so often, and we all had our Spring 2014 chance last week!!!!!!

[Dick Hosmer]

Sorry about the duplicated post!!

[Dan Shapiro]

The only thing stopping me is the lack of money!

Yep. I know the feeling!

[psteinmayer]

A fair price perhaps, but no raging steal. That only happens every so often, and we all had our Spring 2014 chance last week!!!!!!

Understood. I'm still learning how to value the good ones, although I've seen 1898s at gun shows for far more, which is why I thought this was priced low. I'm getting there though, LOL

[Dick Hosmer]

Paul, I sorta watch what happens on Gunbroker - it is, like anything else - less than perfect, but it offers, all in one convenient spot, a chance to see numerous (way more than at nearly any show) rifles & carbines, from all over the country, in various degrees of condition, with varying levels of pricing. The true value lies in seeing which guns are receiving bids and which are not. I believe it is a far better indicator of the market than just about anything else.

The only 1894 rifles worth big bucks are those which have not been up-graded. One such was sold, at a ridiculously low price, last week. Properly marketed - better text and MUCH better pictures - that should have brought at least double what it did. I pity the LOL who likely got no more than $75-$100 for her husband's treasure. At least the ignorant (and predatory?) gun-shop owner didn't really benefit much.

[psteinmayer]

That's why I always pay pretty good attention to what you, and a few others say... I know you are always shooting straight with me.

I try to avoid looking at Gunbroker because I get bummed about not being able to afford to bid on any of them. I should start though.

[CPC]

Would 775 be a better price for the rifle. It does have a modified stock. The ramrod hole has been plugged.

[Dick Hosmer]

I'd still think you could do better elsewhere on a 92/96, but yes, anytime you can get a discount off the posted price it is a plus!

[madsenshooter]

If it has a thick wrist stock, as Dick observed, there shouldn't have been a slot to plug.

[Dick Hosmer]

I looked again - I must have been wrong - it has a thin wrist, or, I was not looking at the correct Krag. It's at Dundee MI, right? Bob's point above is correct - only thin wrist stocks would have groove fillers.

[psteinmayer]

Yes, it's Dundee Michigan.

[CPC]

Yes it is at Dundee. The filler goes all the way to the lower band if you look close in person. I did not take a pick. I put it on hold as I wanted to wait for your comments. I may be able to do better because cabelas also is running a military appreciation sale for the next couple of days. I'm not a krag guy but have wanted a representative model that may have been used in the span-am war. Most likely wasn't but at least it is early enough. Probably not the best gun for the price but the screws are not buggered up and it looks ok. It's an early rifle so who knows where it has been.
Regards and thanks for the comments.
Cc

[madsenshooter]

Hmm, the photos Dick based his "thick wrist" comment on must not have been very good. It's hard for me to tell on my computer screen, which stretches images. It had me wondering as Paul had noted a proper 1895 cartouche. The 92s, 92/96, 96 rifles and carbines probably saw more service in the Span Am War than model 98s, especially in Cuba. 98s didn't make it to the Pacific until about the time of Boxer Rebellion.

[psteinmayer]

I'm thinking of heading back today or Monday because I need some powder. If I can talk them into it, I'll try and get a couple good pictures... but Cabelas is not known for being friendly that way, so ......

[pickax]

I detoured to Lansing for daughters graduation on my way to Maine last week. Saw the water tower sign beckoning me in at Dundee and thought about this thread.
I resisted the siren song and pushed on. Looks like this rifle is still in play, and they are lowering price. Good luck to someone!
By the way Madsenshooter, your countryside is gorgeous. The rest? Well I'm not a farmer so.............

[CPC]

Here is a picture of the cartouche...

[psteinmayer]

Looking at the picture, it looks more like 1896... but in person, it looked more like 1895 to me.

[CPC]

It's the camera on my phone. In real life and resized it looks like 1895. Especially if you look at it beside an 1896 cartouche.

[madsenshooter]

Looks like a 5 to me, but I have a couple here to compare it to. The end of the filler was odd compared to mine, they must've had a lot of damage to fix. Could be the rifle saw some action before it got upgraded to 96 standards. Both of mine have a semi-circle out there on the end, one bigger than the other, which corresponds to the width of the filler. 22018 has a filler only .225 wide, it's likely a rifle converted before every leaving Springfield. 12904 is approx .450 wide, must've been issued and got a little wear before upgrade.

[psteinmayer]

Went by Cabelas today and the Krag is no longer there. They told me it was sold. This might be because CPC put it on hold... but anyways, it was no longer in the Gun Library!