all original Winchester m1carbine??

[tuonofish]

New to the forum and have a newly acquired Winchester m1 carbine. As I research this gun, I am finding there are lots of variations. Was told by seller it was his dads bring home. Serial number is in the mid 1200000. I don't know a whole lot about these guns and would appreciate and feedback. Also need a sling and oiler so any help on what and where to get would be great

[tuonofish]

A few more pics

[Mike in NC]

The adjustable rear sight certainly isn't original to this rifle. The recoil plate, bolt, trigger housing, barrel band, barrel, handguard, and stock look OK. Can't tell if the stock is highwood or low wood. Finish on the metal parts look like they are likely original finish. There aren't enough pictures of other parts to tell much.

[tuonofish]

Mike

From the research i have done, i was guessing the rear sight had been changed. What I don't understand about that is whether the soldier just had added at some point as perfered or if it has gone through a rebuild. And how does that effect it as collectible. What other pics would help. Thanks

[Mike in NC]

Many carbines had the rear sight replaced with adjustable rear sight as a field modification. Not likely the individual soldier did it but at a unit level. Some other pictures that would help would include back of slide (is it round or straight cut), top of front sight, picture of the hammer from side. Really, taking apart the trigger housing group and pictures of markings on individual parts would help if you are comfortable with taking it down and reassembling the trigger group. A picture of the right side of the stock full length with handguard in place would let us know if the stock is highwood or low wood. Pictures of any stamping on metal parts would help, most will have some kind of contractor markings.

Looks like a real nice carbine from the pictures so far.

[Tuna]

As Mike said the rear sight is not original to your carbine. But when DCM was selling carbines in the early 60's some had a very few updates done to them, some were completely rebuilt and some had just the rear sight changed. Your might have been one of these.

[BrianQ]

There is a good possibility the rear sight is the original one as installed by Winchester.

[tuonofish]

Thanks gents for you input so far. I took down the trigger assembly and all parts marked with "w". Hammer, trigger, shear, mag catch. Didn't see anything on the safety. Took some pics but not pleased with how they came out. Going to do it again after the Easter stuff is over today. First time to take apart the trigger assembly and it went pretty well. Stopped short of taking bolt apart but i am guessing all marked same there as well. I will add some picks of the stock also. It is a high wood and looks to have the original finish with raised grain. The finish is not as deep burgundy as others I have seen so don't know. Either way the finish is good and stock has some light scratches but basically no dents or gouges. Mike suggested taking a picture of the back of the slide to see if it was square or round cut. I am a little confused where on the slide he is talking about

[Tuna]

Brian, Wouldn't this serial number date to about August 1943 time frame and the fact that it's a spring tube preclude it from being a reused serial number at a later date?

[Tuna]

Where the slide attaches to the barrel and the recoil spring guide goes into the slide. Does it look like it's a straight across piece or is it rounded?

[dave]

I dould it is your Dads "bring back", as the US Gov. owned them and soldiers were not allowed to retain them. If it is it was stolen from the US!
This story about bring back carbines and M1 rifles is so commen its a wonder the Army had any left after the war!

[Johnny in Texas]

The rear sight is an H marked Milled type 2 sight same as Winchester used. I have an very early Underwood that has the same upgrade with an Underwood straight hammer late hammer spring and stamped rear sight as used by Underwood. The carbine could have been upgraded by Winchester before it was shipped. It could have failed inspection and been retained by Winchester was repaired and left Winchester with the up graded sight. Does it have a straight Winchester hammer or a dogleg hammer and how many coils in the hammer spring? It cannot be proven of but it is very possible and likely to be true if the hammer and spring have been changed also.

[Tuna]

There are a lot of documented carbines that were brought back during WW2 by returning GI's. They fit in the duffle bag with no problems what so ever so they were easy to get home. Underwood never used the adjustable rear sights. Only the type 1 flip sight.

[tuonofish]

I haven't had time to take any more pics. I will. For now, all I can tell you that it seems to have the type 4 slide. Not the straight cut. Has a high would stock with a deep cut sight groove fore grip. No other markings on the stock other than what is shown in the pics. Johnny, I will look at the hammer and spring. When I had it apart before I was thinking that the finish of the hammer didn't quite match the rest of the parts. Maybe that's normal. From what I have read I don't think the changes or upgrade were done in an armory rebuild. The carbine retains too many Winchester parts for that, I think. Dave, I don't know about the military's policy on bringing back during that period and I do know there are many people claiming to have such a weapon. All I am stating is what I was told (not by my farther). Compared to what I am seeing on the web, this gun is a peach. And it will be for sale. I thank Tuna, Dave and the others for help sorting through the uncertainties that seem to follow these guns

[tuonofish]

Took some more pics.

[tuonofish]

More pics

[Johnny in Texas]

A real peach +1

[Tuna]

It is a very nice carbine with the only thing wrong being the rear sight. If it has not been staked in then the sight can be changed for an original for a nice restoration.

[Johnny in Texas]

Or left Original as a WW2 unit upgraded M1 carbine! It could have been state side on was upgrade here. There were lots of M1 carbine that spent the war here in the good ol USA. Many of those were taken home after the war as well.