1911 NRA 1903, really nice

[cplnorton]

I don't get excited by too much I find. But I fell in love with this. As far as I can tell it's 100% original and I really don't know if it's been fired much, if any at all. The bore is a like a mirror and it just doesn't have wear on it at all.

What do you guys think of this one?

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190720.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190726.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190727.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190729.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190732.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190734.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190737.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190738.jpg

[cplnorton]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190702.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190696.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190694.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190690.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190689.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190686.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190675.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190678.jpg

[cplnorton]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190831.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190830.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190821.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190819.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190811.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190805.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190801.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190796.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190794.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190791.jpg

[cplnorton]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190785.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190782.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190780.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190778.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190760.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190758.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190757.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190748.jpg

[cplnorton]

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190745.jpg

http://i1052.photobucket.com/albums/s441/cplnorton3/1911%20NRA%201903/P1190813.jpg

[Fred]

Where is this rifle at? Is it for sale or something?

[cplnorton]

No I just bought it. :)

[Fred]

Way Cool!!!

[Rick the Librarian]

**Drool!!** Do you HAVE to ask what I think about it?? :)

I've got its slightly older "brother", #477541, also an NRA Sales rifle:

http://www.fototime.com/287DFBB5B4134E7/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/C7541FC0BF4A6B9/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/B179C95A682E285/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/A16F94A3963A8BC/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/CA779D6D2BACB6A/standard.jpg

http://www.fototime.com/EB3C28804E69361/standard.jpg

[cplnorton]

I had an original RIA that I had to sell when my son was born and I had a lot of medical bills. I always said I would like to find another original Pre-WWI rifle. I ran across this by total accident and the seller made me a heck of a deal on it. So I bought it.

I'm no expert on 1903's, but as far as I can tell it's all original.

[cplnorton]

Rick your's has the same kind of wood. Did they use a fancy type of walnut or something on the NRA's? I can't imagine they put stocks like that on service rifles did they?

By the way really nice rifle Rick! It's hard to believe they are 103 years old.

[Rick the Librarian]

Probably John Beard would be the best one to answer that. As I recall, they took some extra time on these rifles. Whether it extended to picking out better wood, I don't know.

[cplnorton]

Now these were taken when new off the line and sold to NRA members right? Or did they sit in armories for a while and then sold? I imagine since all seem to be in this range, they were probably taken directly from the line and then shipped. Am I correct?

I'm not as well versed on 1903's as I am other stuff. Especially these rare 1903's.

[pmclaine]

Are those low number rifles? Ship them to me for your own safety.

[PeteDavis]

Awesome pieces, both.

PD

[Fred]

I'm Very jealous and am Coveting your rifle!
I recall seeing an image of that oiler. Was this rifle listed on Gun broker or guns international?
I've got to ask you, what did you have to pay for it???

[cplnorton]

I'm not sure if it was ever listed on any of the gun sites. I saw it on Facebook. I am a member of a group of militaria that people post WTS ads. Most of it posted is junk, but they posted this for sale on there. They only posted one or two pics and they weren't the best. I figured it nothing else it was worth what I paid, but I was very pleased when I picked it up at the FFL. It was 10x better looking in person than the pics. In fact, I finally found my Muzzle guage today. It guages a 0 at the Muzzle. I don't know if it was ever fired after it was proofed. It it was, it couldn't have been much. The bore is perfect.

I picked it up for $1500 shipped.

[Fred]

Highway Robbery... That's what it was. You made out like a bandit. Yessiree! My hats off to you!
I'd have paid even more for it.

[Emri]

VERY NICE !!! Thanks for sharing. We never get tired of seeing early rifles.

Emri

[John Beard]

Rick is right. The sales rifles had a higher grade of wood, fit, and finish. The rifles were also star-gauged and targeted.

J.B.

p.s.,

Very Nice rifle! Thanks for sharing!

[m1903rifle]

Here's one that Mr. Beard thought had a good chance of being a very early NRA Sales rifle.

[StockDoc]

Wow! Congratulation on some nice rifles. Both look right out of a time machine.

[LAH]

Here's another one..... SA 7 - 11 Barrel .... about a 186 older than yours Cplnorton

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/454908000/454908919/pix612989096.jpg

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/454908000/454908919/pix141757660.jpg

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/454908000/454908919/pix651582517.jpg

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/454908000/454908919/pix427971475.jpg

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/454908000/454908919/pix240941570.jpg

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/454908000/454908919/pix709635970.jpg

http://pics.gunbroker.com/GB/454908000/454908919/pix710434097.jpg

[cplnorton]

It just blows my mind these exist. Especially in this condition. It's really hard to believe they are 103 years old. I mean when they were made, most people still traveled by horse and buggy. It just really makes you think.

[Rick the Librarian]

When I first started collecting M1903s, I had the idea that pre-WWI M1903s in original condition were very rare. There sure have been a lot of them coming out of the woodwork. Of course, I think that NRA Sales rifles are the most common "original" M1903s. I think in many cases, they were put into a closet after being used a little.

They sure are "purty"! :D

[cplnorton]

I wonder how many still exist? Has anyone kept track of the serials of the NRA's?

[Rick the Librarian]

I believe John Beard has a list - obviously, I'm sure he would admit it is FAR from all-inclusive.

[Fred]

Darnnit guys, now I have to get one for myself!

[Chaz]

1915 NRA: sn 617398, and in similar condition to those pictured above.

[John Beard]

I believe John Beard has a list - obviously, I'm sure he would admit it is FAR from all-inclusive.

I do indeed have a list of known sales rifles. A statistical analysis shows that it contains about 7% of the rifles originally sold. I express my gratitude to those many who took time to make contributions.

J.B.

[LAH]

Yet another 1903 NRA Rifle with SA 7- 11 barrel....enjoy :hello:

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/hamiltol/c5207df9-a944-4c8a-bb16-7689da263f81_zps69375f98.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/hamiltol/5a5b99c0-6c75-4693-90d5-3c4f4dd2ba64_zpsa8391006.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/hamiltol/f2020b09-46fb-4120-a669-101de5411e4b_zps671d3152.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/hamiltol/349a0e7e-09af-42da-a6ef-9bc47ae25a64_zps18868e36.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/hamiltol/f0ccc336-5fd1-4b10-9b7c-f6cc3904990a_zpsc83c25c3.jpg

http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v209/hamiltol/48bcc9dc-eff9-4c47-9204-ec8cef8810dd_zps486231cb.jpg

[John Beard]

Very nice rifle! Thanks for sharing!

I will make you aware that the rifle was stamped "N.R.A." retroactively several years after it had been sold.

Thanks again!

J.B.

[da gimp]

aw geez john.... you're teasing us again......... not doubting your word at all........... the NRA looks off center not marked in a straight line & the flaming bomb is a lil off center from the NRA logo a lil too........ or am I missing it all again?

[LAH]

The rifles pics I have in the thread I borrowed off GB. They are currently there for sale now. I don't have any connection to them whatsoever. Just search 1911 1903.:hello:

[John Beard]

aw geez john.... you're teasing us again......... not doubting your word at all........... the NRA looks off center not marked in a straight line & the flaming bomb is a lil off center from the NRA logo a lil too........ or am I missing it all again?

The "N.R.A." marking wasn't authorized until 1915. Rifles made and sold prior to 1915 were stamped retroactively.

J.B.

[Rick the Librarian]

The "N.R.A." marking wasn't authorized until 1915. Rifles made and sold prior to 1915 were stamped retroactively.

J.B.

Good to know that - you learn something new every day.

[Fred]

Yep! Thanks John.

[Dick Hosmer]

Looks just like mine, except yours is nicer!!!!

[Rick the Librarian]

Dick, your rifle ain't anything to sneeze at, either! :D

I also have NRA Sales rifle 554,131 with a 7-13 barrel; in what I realize is a "What do you want, eggs in your beer"-statement, I wish my 477,000 range rifle had a 6-11 barrel. The 7-13 barrel is the same month and year my mother was born; a 6-11 would be the birthdat of my dad! :D

[Fred]

I'll be on the lookout Dick!

[cplnorton]

Fred, I just tried to write you back. Your inbox is full. Thanks sir. :)

[Fred]

OK Steve, I've made room!

[Ironlip]

I picked it up for $1500 shipped.

That's about what I paid for mine.......in 1988!!!

[Ironlip]

The "N.R.A." marking wasn't authorized until 1915. Rifles made and sold prior to 1915 were stamped retroactively.

J.B.

It's rare that I can add anything to what Brother Beard has to share about '03's, but this time I can provide a little documentation. Not long after I bought mine I contacted Frank Mallory of Springfield Research Service about the fact that my 1911 rifle (SN 481260 Bbl Date 7-11) had the NRA mark on the trigger guard, a mark which had not been applied until 1915 according to the then recently published Brophy book on '03's. Reproduced below is his letter in response and the page from the Springfield Research Service Newsletter to which he refers:

[John Beard]

I have the Springfield Research Newsletter in your picture. That's where my information came from. A very high percentage of pre-1915 rifles were never located and marked. In addition, rifles sold to military officers and certain eligible individuals were also never marked. That's why I refer to them as "Sales Rifles" and not "NRA Sales Rifles", because many of them were sold to others besides NRA members.

J.B.

[cplnorton]

That's about what I paid for mine.......in 1988!!!

I think part of the reason she sold it so cheap, she got into it really cheap. She said she had a table at a gunshow and someone walked in with it and traded it for a couple hundred dollar rifle.

That would have been a nice trade to make. :)

[Rick the Librarian]

A few months ago, Rock Island Auctions had several "Sales" rifles which went for very attractive prices. As I recall, one had a couple of parts changed out and went for about $650!! This may be partially due to the current stagnant economy.

[Fred]

It must've been their dad's or mom's rifle that was retrieved from a closet or cabinet after the parent died or went to a nursing home. It happens. Kids will cash in on what they don't want or know about.

[Dan Shapiro]

Kids will cash in on what they don't want or know about.

Ain't that the sad truth!

[cplnorton]

I think she said it was a kid and it was willed to him by the grandfather.

How you could sell something like that. Probably had been in the family for 50 years or more. So sad.

[Rick the Librarian]

It just depends on your interest, the space you have and your philosophy. My older brother passed away a couple of years back and had thousands of CDs on classical music in his apartment in New York. While I was fairly sure a few of them might have been fairly rare, I didn't have the time and money to spend an extensive time going through them and I had to let them go for probably not near what they were worth. I felt bad, but I was up against time and distance (I lived 3000 miles away).

[SPEEDGUNNER]

I don't blame you for falling in love, that 1903 is a real beaut!

[dokcop]

Mr Beard: I have another NRA sales rifle for your list. #609548 is in nearly new condition, bbl dated 8-15, and is accompanied by the original SA star gauge card dated Oct 2 1915, signed by "Riley". It bears a M1907 RIA sling dated 1914 in almost new condition and was found in what is probably the original (decrepit) issue canvas and leather sleeve.

[Fred]

Pictures?

[dokcop]

Sadly, I've not mastered the ability to post pics. Id' love to show you guys this lovely rifle and a few others. Maybe that will inspire me to learn the skill.

[Fred]

No skill necessary. I send my pictures from my iphone camera to my email address.
From there, I send them to My Pictures.
I then go to my Photobucket album and download the pictures from My Pictures into my Photobucket.
Then, I transfer the photo's from Photobucket to the forum here.


Others might have different ways to do it.

[Dick Hosmer]

I move pics from my camera's data card to the folder hierarchy on my computer, then follow the upload procedure here. Or, for stuff that I want on the net permanently, I post them to my webpage - www.picturetrail.com/sa4570af

[Rick the Librarian]

or... you can email the pictures to me and I'll post them:

rrsbls[at]msn.com (make usual substitution).

[John Beard]

Mr Beard: I have another NRA sales rifle for your list. #609548 is in nearly new condition, bbl dated 8-15, and is accompanied by the original SA star gauge card dated Oct 2 1915, signed by "Riley". It bears a M1907 RIA sling dated 1914 in almost new condition and was found in what is probably the original (decrepit) issue canvas and leather sleeve.

Many thanks for taking the time to post the information on your rifle! I have captured it for my data base. I am pleased to inform you that your rifle is one of nine rifles in my data base all within a 100-rifle consecutive serial number block. So there's no question whatsoever about it's authenticity! Of course, with a star gauge record card, there's no question about it anyway!

I would be grateful to receive the rifle inspector's initials for my data base. Thanks again for taking the time to respond! And Happy Holidays!

J.B.

[dokcop]

Re # 609548. The rifle bears the JFC cartouche. Please advise if any other markings are of interest.

Regards and a safe Christmas to you all. Dokcop

[John Beard]

Re # 609548. The rifle bears the JFC cartouche. Please advise if any other markings are of interest.

Regards and a safe Christmas to you all. Dokcop


Got it! Thanks!

And Merry Christmas to you and yours!

J.B.

[Tom Trevor]

Mr. Beard I believe you already have my NRA rifle 609536 with the 6-15 barrel date and JFC cartouche?

[John Beard]

Mr. Beard I believe you already have my NRA rifle 609536 with the 6-15 barrel date and JFC cartouche?

Yes, I have your rifle in my data base!

Thanks for the reminder! But I have it recorded with an S.A./5-15 dated barrel. Please re-confirm the barrel date.

Thanks again! And Happy Holidays!

J.B.

[Tom Trevor]

It is 6-15 Happy holiday to all here.

[John Beard]

Got it! And thanks for taking the time to look and post correction!

Merry Christmas!

J.B.