03 Stock Hardware Question

[robh5]

Would the bayonet lug on a 950,000 range M1903 be marked with a H, or would that be post war?
Thanks.

[Rick the Librarian]

Yes, it would be so-marked. The "H" stamp was used well before WWI.

[Fred]

Rock Island front bands didn't use the H stamp by the way. Just Springfield.

[Rick the Librarian]

Thanks for the clarification - the rifle was in the 900,000 range, so I didn't think that was a factor.

[Fred]

Rick, I knew that you knew it was a Sprinfield receiver, but my comment was for the poster. I just wanted him to know that any front barrel band without the H stamped on the bayonet lug was made at Rock Island Arsenal.

[Rick the Librarian]

Rick, I knew that you knew it was a Sprinfield receiver, but my comment was for the poster. I just wanted him to know that any front barrel band without the H stamped on the bayonet lug was made at Rock Island Arsenal.
+1:icon_wink:

[John Beard]

Rick, I knew that you knew it was a Sprinfield receiver, but my comment was for the poster. I just wanted him to know that any front barrel band without the H stamped on the bayonet lug was made at Rock Island Arsenal.

Forgive me for laughing. I needed some humor on this cold winter day.

Springfield Armory bands made prior to 1908 didn't have the "H" either. So Rock Island was not the only one who made bands sans "H".

J.B. :hello:

[robh5]

Rick, I knew that you knew it was a Sprinfield receiver, but my comment was for the poster. I just wanted him to know that any front barrel band without the H stamped on the bayonet lug was made at Rock Island Arsenal.

I had forgot to add that it is a Springfield receiver.
I never new that a front band without the H was RIA made (minus the pre 1908 Springfield bands as mentioned by J Beard). Thanks for the info.

[Rick the Librarian]

To which I would add the milled upper bands made for the Remington M1903 during WWII. They also lacked the "H" stamp.

[Fred]

John that's a good thing to know. Thanks. Hopefully now, anybody reading this thread with such a front band on their correct pre 1908 Sprinfield will think twice about switching it out for a later H stamped band.

[John Beard]

Fred,

If you like quizzes, try this one. Do you know the difference between a Springfield Armory upper band and a Rock Island upper band (besides the "H" marking)?

J.B.

[Fred]

Nope, I don't. Could it be the length of the cut underneath the stacking swivel? Could it be the bevel on the bayonet lug? I don't have a Rock Island band at hand to study.
By the way, I noticed just the other day that the H stamped on the Bayonet lug of my 1917 dated rifle with the serial number of 753299 is noticeably smaller than the H's on my 1918 and 1919 dated 03's. Have you any idea as to when the switch was made to the larger stamp John? Thanks.

[John Beard]

Springfield Armory upper bands were die-forged. Rock Island Arsenal upper bands were forge-welded. There! Now you can easily distinguish one from the other without having to look for an "H"! :eusa_wall:

I do not know when a transition from small "H" to large "H" occurred. But I do have some documentation about retroactively stamping "H's".

J.B. :hello:

[the_1st_sgt]

Mr. Beard

I'm guessing that the grain patterns on the bands would look different from the two methods. Is it possible for you to post photos of the two makers bands for us to see?

Mike George

[Rick the Librarian]

I can handle metallurgy questions about as well as nuclear physics, but here are two pictures of upper bands from an original Springfield and Rock Island:

The one with the sight protector is an early (16,000 range) RIA; the other is a NRA Sales rifle in the 554,000 range. I realize the upper band has a little damage, but you still get the idea. Now, if someone would explain the difference!! LOL!

3432734328

[John Beard]

Mr. Beard

I'm guessing that the grain patterns on the bands would look different from the two methods. Is it possible for you to post photos of the two makers bands for us to see?

Mike George

I regret that I am unable to post the photos you seek.

J.B.

[Fred]

I sure as heck don't know what to look for.

[robh5]

I sure as heck don't know what to look for.
^^^^^
Me too.
Any way to describe what to look for between die-forged, and forge welded?

[louis]

I'm not sure there is anything to look for. The difference in the two techniques are weld forge are two pieces of metal heated and forged together and shaped whereas the die forge is one piece of metal heated and forged into shape. From there I couldn't tell you any more except that maybe you can see a line but I doubt it.

[ElWoodman]

....Unless it has no "H", but does have an "R" on the side.......

[MikeS]

I am not a big poster on the forums and by far am no expert. With Ricks photos that he posted it appears quite clear to me the difference as the SA upper band has a much more grainy type finish almost as if it was sand blasted where as the RIA upper band has a much smoother finish. I don't know if RIA's method was much harder or easier but it appears to be much nicer and that more care or time was taken in the fabrication process.

Great Post,

Mike