M1873 carbines?

[Stephan]

I bought a not too unfortunate M1873 carbine that had been floating around on an online auction site for several months. Anyhow I bid and got it(no competing bidders)...will make a fair/decent shooter I think. Have been wanting a M1873 carbine for years and already own a M1873 Rifle. Had considered a Pedersoli M1873 carbine But those are expensive!....Actually cheaper to buy the real-deal...

Anyhow...I'm about ignorant about M1873 Springfield carbines and model designations. My old Trapdoor carbine was made in 1880 according to the serial number....somewhere/somehow it got refurbed with a Buffington sight and M90 band...plus a 'Model 1884' marked breechblock. So my question is..is my carbine now a 'Model 1884' carbine?

I know collectors have various designations for the Trapdoor 1873 rifles and carbines...like my 1881 vintage rifle is what seems to be called a 1879 model(has that style rear sight)...I presume my 1880 vintage carbine would've been a 1877 pattern carbine originally with the serrated curved ramp rear sight.

I know the early carbines had the thin-wrist stocks and no cleaning rod trap in the stock..rear sight that was notch-stepped. The later M1877 type with thicker wrist stock and cleaning rod trap...maybe earlier or later style rear sight. Then you have the Buffington sighted M1884 like mine has been rebuilt into. Is that pretty much the gist of the M1873 carbine variations??

[dave]

Go to Trap Door forum below, Dick Hosmer wrote a book on them.

[Dick Hosmer]

To address ALL of the nuances of that carbine question is well beyond the scope of this forum. So far as the physical markings were concerned there were two models, 1873 and 1884. Some contemporary papers refer to Model 1877 for the carbine, but not the rifle - which is generally assumed to refer to those guns having the stock trap. No guns were ever marked 1877.

There were four rear sights 1873 (stepped), 1877 (sloped, without windage), 1879 sloped, with windage, 1884 Buffington (lays flat). Most of these had more than one type.

The several changes to the stock, receiver, block, etc. mostly occurred at different times creating numerous (some quite scarce) "transitional" featured arms.

The only change of note between late "Model 1873" carbines and "Model 1884" carbines was the sight. The blocks were identical except for the marking, so the old ones were used until exhaustion, which was well after the adoption of the 1884 sight. The last 5000 carbines, made in 1889, were "pure" Model 1884s (meaning they had both the block and the sight from birth).

The biggest thing to remember is that the items were tools, no one cared about what people would worry over 100+ years later, and that SA was frugal. Items were used and repaired until they were no longer serviceable. Add in all of the changes done by Bannerman et al, and the crystal ball really clouds over. Hope that helps.

[Stephan]

But..but..maybe John Wayne carried this one in a movie!!...Or could've rode with Pancho Villa! Might be a Bannerman's too as it has a pretty cool stock...made from about four inches of a genuine carbine stock neatly grafted onto a rifle-stock rear section under the band. That all looks decently done...however the stock's butt has some rather crude internal inletting done to accommodate the trapdoor mechanism in the carbine butt-plate...and not drilled for cleaning-rods either.

If the CMP had sold this one it would be 'rack-grade' or less....