Pistol caliber 7.65 vs 30 Luger

[Major Tom]

Are these the same cartridge? For reloading, what diameter bullet is correct? Thank you

[Tuna]

Yes they are. 7.65 has been used as a designation for .30 Luger over the years mostly in Europe. .30 Luger is most often found as having .308 or .309 diameter bullets weighting in about 85 to 95 grs.

[dave]

But it not the same cart. as the Mauser pistol, correct?

[RCS]

396333963439632Early 7,65mm German loads, the hollow point load is "hot" for the pistol carbine I was told ?

[Tuna]

No it is not the same cartridge as the 7.62 Mauser. The case is shorter and the over all length is shorter then the Mauser. Now the Mauser is all but identical to the 7.62 Tokarev except the Tok is loaded much hotter then the Mauser round. Loaded hot for use in machineguns. One should never use the Tokarev round in a 1896 Mauser pistol as the pistol will come apart before too many rounds have been fired.

[Johnny P]

One and the same. The .30 Luger designation was the Americanization of the 7.65 Luger as it was know in Europe.

Strange thing is that the bottleneck 7.65 Luger cartridge preceded the 9mm Luger cartridge.

http://i67.tinypic.com/ieqsd2.jpg

[Major Tom]

The reason the 7.65 and 30 luger cartridges were produced: between the wars, the Allies Treaty with Germany requiered they could not make 9mm or larger pistol rounds. Germany got around that provision by making the 7.65 and 30 luger rounds. The provision was generally ignored tho.

[Johnny P]

The 7.65 Luger cartridge came out in 1900, and the 9mm did not come out until 1902.

Following the end of WWI the Treaty of Versailles forbid the manufacture of any caliber larger than 8mm and a barrel length of 4" or longer. Since the 7.65mm had been in production for 18 years it was a simple matter to make a barrel approximately 1/16" shorter in 7.65mm for the commercial market. Germany was allowed to produce enough 9mm Lugers to arm the police and military authorized by the treaty.

This is a Model 1900 "American Eagle" produced in 1900 or 1901 in the 7.65mm caliber. At that time the Lugers destined for the American market had the great seal of the United States on the chamber.

http://i63.tinypic.com/nxv0io.jpg

http://i66.tinypic.com/hwizax.jpg

[Tuna]

Johnny P is that 1900 yours? It's a fantastic Luger. I don't think I have seen any that are better then this one.

[Johnny P]

Yep, it is mine. Being a commercial it had a better chance of survival if it belonged to someone that took care of it.