View Full Version : US marked Remington M31
I have a 12 ga Remington Model 31, sn 520xx, skeet grade with checkered beavertail forehand and grip, 26" IC solid rib bbl with middle bead, anodized aluminum trigger housing assembly, Bbl, receiver and trigger group all matching, bbl code OK (anchor) which I believe reflects July 1941 production. Receiver stamped RLB with ordnance bomb. No stock cartouche. The gun appears correct and is a solid 90-92%, displaying the commercial Remington matte blue of the period.
I'm disposing of the bulk of my US martial collection and am not a shotgun guy. I've read that the Army acquired every commercial 12 ga short barreled shotgun it could find post 12-7-41 for the purpose of training air crews in aerial gunnery. Apparently they included higher grade guns as well. Beyond that I have no idea this gun's scarcity or value
Can anyone venture an opinion of the gun's value based on the above information? All opinions gratefully accepted. Dokcop
Need to post pics. Remington shotguns are NOT generally marked RLB, although other Rem guns are.
In that range, I would expect to see a funky looking bomb on the receiver, looks like a flower pot.
And Rem 31 finishes are NOT matte.
But again, need to post pics
Need to post pics. Remington shotguns are NOT generally marked RLB, although other Rem guns are.
In that range, I would expect to see a funky looking bomb on the receiver, looks like a flower pot.
And Rem 31 finishes are NOT matte.
But again, need to post pics
Thank you for your reply. I'm not of the computer generation and have had no luck posting pictures.
The receiver does exhibit the "funky looking bomb"- the ordnance bomb., below the Bowlin stamp. "Matte" may not be the right descriptor. I've owned numerous excellent original condition prewar Remington arms over the years; Models 17, 37, 24, several 241s, etc., all of which exhibited the same subdued lustrous blue that this shotgun retains.
Don't mean to be argumentative. I'm quite sure that the RLB cartouche is correct, and am looking for a value range. Apparently this gun is something of an aberration if a Remington enthusiast like yourself is not familiar with this configuration. I'll keep looking. Regards, Dokcop
I so happen to have a RLB marked 31. It has longbarrel, front checked grip, plain butt stock, full chocked.
I don't see any other military markings.
https://i.imgur.com/AA7m7b7.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/e8tFS0n.jpg
Kent
Remington said mine was made in 1941.
Also they said the Model 31 was made 1931 - 1949
Kent
scosgt: I've managed to take some pictures and import them to my computer. if you're interested in seeing them and want to give me your email, I think I can figure out how to send them via email to you. RLB stamp and ordnance bomb are essentially identical to Dogfoot's gun, other than appearing on the rear rather than the front of the left side of the receiver. My email is dokcop@gmail.com. Regards
Dog foot: Thanks for the reply. Wonder how many more re out there?
scosgt: I've managed to take some pictures and import them to my computer. if you're interested in seeing them and want to give me your email, I think I can figure out how to send them via email to you. RLB stamp and ordnance bomb are essentially identical to Dogfoot's gun, other than appearing on the rear rather than the front of the left side of the receiver. My email is dokcop@gmail.com. Regards
Yep, that is the right bomb for that Remington. The one I had also had the bomb on the rear of the receiver. Like I said, I have never seen one marked RLB. He was the inspector for the Rochester Ordinance District at that time. His mark should ONLY appear on guns bought direct from the factory, NOT on acquisition guns. Quite unusual, but not very many people would know enough to fake that funky looking bomb. I have only ever seen it on a Remington long barrel like yours and on a Stevens I think that was acquired very early, maybe pre-war.
A speculation totally unbased in facts known to me: I've read that Bowlin worked for Remington onsite at the factory. Both Dogbone's gun and mine were made within a few months before 12-7-41. We were in a state of national emergency. The need for shotguns for aerial gunnery training must have been extreme at that point. Did the government simply clean Remington's warehouses out of all available unsold 12 gauges then in stock that fit their parameters? I can't imagine the AAF ordering or acquiring expensive skeet grade guns, especially with solid ribs, using routine procurement, bidding and acquisition methods. Bowling might logically then have been tasked with inspection and acceptance onsite to expedite delivery to the AAF....
No, that is incorrect. Based on the Ithaca records, there were many acquisitions from the factories in 1939-40-41 and they did indeed buy higher grade guns.
BUT, as Eric Archer said:
"Do you REALLY think that RLB himself stamped the guns"?
The RLB mark indicates a factory acquisition. I don't think there can be an argument about that. Guns that were taken into arsenals got totally different markings, and never had an RLB, or WHD, or WB or FJA. Those marks were stamped at the respective factory, and NOT by the actual inspector.
And yes, they did indeed take just about any pump shotgun in inventory at the factory.
The story goes, the 520-30 was discontinued with the introduction of the 620 round back receiver, to compete with the more modern M12.
At the onset of war Uncle contracted with Stevens for all the left over 520-30 receivers laying around unsold at the factory.
I had an Ithaca skeet grade that was stamped FJA. The ONLY FJA stamped Ithaca shotgun I ever heard of. The gun was mint and real. The serials before and after than gun appear in the Ithaca sales records I have. That one does not. The "story" was that this gun was from the estate of a former President of Ithaca Gun. In fact, I bought it from a high end shotgun dealer located about 5 miles from the old Ithaca factory.
Buy the gun, not the story.
But there are some oddballs out there. The Remingtons posted here appear to me to be correct and original (except for recoil pads of course).
The "long barrel M97" was originally a riot gun. The barrel dated 1948 is a dead giveaway. However, M97 military riots in any kind of condition are extremely rare.
I love this stuff, glad I found you guys.
My last long gun, an RLB marked Ithaca 37:
https://i.imgur.com/gIiImfi.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/eiz1QrZ.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/FfY1pVd.jpg
https://i.imgur.com/s5ZZ0ny.jpg
Bubba put a junk choke tube on it ☹️
Kent ����
I have one of the rare ones - marked both UNITED STATES PROPERTY and RLB!
A small lot that went to Springfield Armory just before the war.
Keydet92
03-18-2017, 06:25
Scosgt, that is the "story" on the M520-30 that can be found in print in several places, including Canfield but it's just a story based on a misunderstanding of what really happened at Stevens. The 620 replaced the original 520 in 1927 as the flagship pump for Stevens. The 520 was then dropped from Stevens catalogs in 1929 relegated to trade and store brand production until it was replaced by the 520A in 1940 (also only trade and store brand). It's the 520A, that was new and in full production that was renamed the 520-30 for the military contract. Because you don't see them in Stevens catalogs, people think they were discontinued but over 200K 520 shotguns were made between 1927-39 and 30K 520A shotguns were made between 1940-42. The 520A continued in production after the war until 1948 with over 100K made (including wartime 520-30 production).
scosgt/Keydet92 Thanks very much for the very explicit explanation. Regarding the object of my original post: assuming that my 92% (conservative)) estimate of condition with the bore bright and excellent, no corrosion or damage, gun totally functional (I shot clays with it for years) and clean original wood with original (hard rubber or plastic) buttplate, nothing refinished or buggered with, can you suggest a fair value? I have someone interested in it.
Regards, Dokcop
Keydet92
03-19-2017, 09:05
Dokcop, I apologize for the hijack, just trying to correct that story.
No problem A very interesting discussion. Regards, Dokcop.
DokCop,
I sent you an email.
Kent
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