View Full Version : Vietnam Vet's M14 sends him to the pokey
https://www.foxnews.com/us/vietnam-war-hero-sentenced-to-7-years-for-decades-old-rifle-purchase-report
What I'm hearing thru the grapevine is the guy came to the attention of the ATF back in 2016 when he wore a MAGA hat and supported DJT. Then the IRS stepped in and found out he had hired H&R Block to help him evade taxes by deducting home mortgage interest on his tax returns. In addition, he was in trouble with the HOA for flying the disgusting American flag. Any of that sort of criminality is reason enough to send him or anybody else to prison for the rest of their life.
scratched out serial number=screwed. doesnt matter about anything else in life, anybody with one functioning brain cell knows thats a no-go!
Sounds like he knew it's a Class 3 firearm. All the rest of it is smoke and mirrors. Can't imagine how scratching the S/N off is going to matter one way or the other though. That's a crime all by itself. Unless the thing was stolen.
H&R Block isn't going to help anybody evade taxes.
"...wore a MAGA hat and supported DJT..." The ATF wouldn't care or notice what hat you wear or who you vote for. Neither would the IRS.
scratched out serial number=screwed. doesnt matter about anything else in life, anybody with one functioning brain cell knows thats a no-go!
That and the M14 stamp on the heel of the receiver especially if the select fire parts are still installed.
JB White
10-18-2018, 10:45
He supposedly bought it decades ago. What drew attention to it so the BATF would come looking for it now...and how did they know to go to his house and find it?
Something is not being disclosed.
Sandpebble
10-18-2018, 02:32
What I'm hearing thru the grapevine is the guy came to the attention of the ATF back in 2016 when he wore a MAGA hat and supported DJT. Then the IRS stepped in and found out he had hired H&R Block to help him evade taxes by deducting home mortgage interest on his tax returns. In addition, he was in trouble with the HOA for flying the disgusting American flag. Any of that sort of criminality is reason enough to send him or anybody else to prison for the rest of their life.
The MAGA hat didn't get him arrested ... breaking the law did.
Did he evade taxes owed by law ? ..... seems that way
Did he possess an automatic firearm with no tax stamp ? ... looks that way
Did he possess a fire arm with an altered serial number ? .... seems that way
Was this firearm a civililan M1A that was altered without a tax stamp .... or a stolen government m14 ? ....looks that way
Looks like felony wrap to me all the way round .... even if he wore a Clinton hat he'd be done ... and rightfully so.
Silver Stars are not a free ride to break the law....
He supposedly bought it decades ago. What drew attention to it so the BATF would come looking for it now...and how did they know to go to his house and find it?
Something is not being disclosed.
Obviously he wasn't waiving it around. A MAGA hat would paint crosshairs on him for the democrat based FBI to invade his privacy and look under every stone till something, however minor turned up.
Now since the BATF fines for possessing an unregistered machine gun = 10 years in the state pen and a $100,000 fine where does that leave someone like Eric Holder with the illegal "fast and furious" crime?
Former Cav
10-18-2018, 04:09
something wrong with the story the way and place I read it at.
Of course, the slimestream media is not known for accurate truthful reporting so why would I expect this story to be any different.
If he broke the law (scratched the serial number or had an M14 with NO TAX stamp) well then, too bad so sad!
"you do the crime, you do the time"
about time they start enforcing the laws. hope holder gets his te*ts in the ringer!!
blackhawknj
10-18-2018, 10:48
Yes, someone ratted him out or he shot off his mouth.
Yes, someone ratted him out or he shot off his mouth.
+1
And yeah if he's a collector, then he knows both drills regarding scratched S/Ns and MGs with no ATF stamp. The rest of us live by them rules, so can he. Wonder if he heard a little voice through the years telling him to surrender it, and if he now regrets not listening.
" or had an M14 with no TAX STAMP" There is no such thing as a real military M14 WITH a tax stamp. No M14's were sold by the government.
Johnny P
10-19-2018, 07:15
While no M14's were sold by the military, the Department of Energy did sell a few M14 rifles that had been used as guard guns at nuclear facilities. There is information on the net about the "DOE Guns". Reportedly, there were also some M14's registered in 1968 that were previously stolen.
" or had an M14 with no TAX STAMP" There is no such thing as a real military M14 WITH a tax stamp. No M14's were sold by the government.
FYI:
There were likely a few uncut USGI M14 rifles among the tens of thousands of machine guns registered when the National Firearms Act was revised in 1968. One such amnesty example is Harrington & Richardson M14 serial number 449955. The NFA amnesty period ran from November 02, 1968 to December 01, 1968. At least two Springfield Armory T44E4 rifles made it into the NFA Registry under the amnesty and forty years later remain in the hands of private citizens.
Something's missing from the story...
"[his attorney] learned later that authorities were looking for and seized an M14 rifle that Pick had bought at a Fort Worth gun show in the early eighties."
So the ATF has been looking for a gun for 36 years? That makes no sense. I agree - someone got pissed at him and knew he had the gun and called the ATF.
I do agree that the sentence is excessive. There are murderers and rapists who get less time. I think a stiff fine and 30 days would have been about right given what we know. Again, there has to be more to the story here.
he had a rifle with an altered serial number, end of discussion. doesnt matter if it was an mg42 or some single shot. if the rifle was capable of automatic fire, thats just additional charges.
RETREAD123456
10-19-2018, 10:40
Had. not heard of the DOE M14s. Were some. NM rifles issued to some military schools, besides the service acadamies ??
"...the Department of Energy did..." Those select fire? Just curious. I'd guess they were not.
However, the ATF's 'Once an MG' nonsense matters too. The unelected civil servants at the ATF made a law by regulation and were running around confiscating surplus M-14 receivers that were used to build match rifles several years back.
Anyway, it's guys like this guy who make legitimate collectors a target of the unelected civil servants at the ATF and the media.
Cosine26
10-20-2018, 03:10
The events described here took place more than 55 years ago so I suppose that all of the participants are long gone. The SSGT who told me the story was later KIA in NAM. I thought that you might find this interesting. Another member of one of the teams was formerly an armorer at Ft. Campbell KY and he indicated that on every night (drop parachute troops) they lost two or three rifles .
Missing M14
In the 1960;s I was living in west Texas , near two army camps. I was a high power rifle competitor so I knew well several members of the both post rifle teams and one a SSGT was a very good friend. Here is the story.
The US Army had converted to the M14 in both issue and NM versions. On a night maneuver, an M 14 turned up missing. This resulted in a very careful and diligent searched for by several government agencies. The rifle was nowhere to be found. Needless to say the Commanding General was very unhappy and had every one on alert. Eventually he convened a Board of Survey and the rifle was declared lost. It did not look good on the CG's fitness report. About six months later , the rifle turned up. The CG was not happy. He said "That rifle is gone- never to return! . Make it disappear "- in no uncertain terms, and it did.
There were persistent reports of a clandestine M14 for sale in the local rifle community. Neither I nor any of my associates would touch it with a ten foot pole. I moved away and never heard anymore about it.
Thought you might find this interesting.
FWIW
I saw one show up on ebay years ago. Guns and frames have always been illegal on ebay and this was before they became so anti-gun on parts but somehow it slipped through. Perhaps it was listed as a 7.62 or something. All I remember is I found it and put it on my watch list. It was a Winchester M14. It may have had a welded receiver---I don't know. The seller claimed it shot real well. It sold for $1500. This was about 25 years ago. I could have had it at this price (buy it now) but didn't want to touch it with a 10' pole because I suspected a trap. You never know who's on the other end.
While I'll always see this as a missed opportunity, I'll always know it may have been an opportunity to go to jail too. I bought a couple of M1 carbine receivers on ebay from a seller in Greece. He had them listed as paperweights. After making a couple of sales he trusted me and offered me M14 receivers for around $400ea. Again, I passed even knowing the seller was safe, the receivers would never be legal, plus the packages could have been inspected by customs on either end. You used to be able to find some interesting items on ebay. Now days, even though they still know nothing about guns, there is always someone who does that will report such listings and get them deleted and the seller eliminated.
Johnny P
10-20-2018, 05:40
Had. not heard of the DOE M14s. Were some. NM rifles issued to some military schools, besides the service acadamies ??
From M14 Rifle History and Development, Fifth Edition:
"U. S. Department of Energy - The U. S. Department of Energy (DOE) purchased twenty-five Springfield Armory, Inc. M21 models in the late 1990s for its Special Response Force. The commercial M21 rifles performed well. The DOE subsequently purchased USGI M14 rifles from Anniston Army Depot. At one point, the DOE inventory of M14 rifles was about 300. The M14 rifles were stored in three different locations. Scoped DOE M14 rifles were fitted with Smith Enterprise, Inc. Weaver style rail XM-21 scope mounts.
As of 2007, most of the M14 rifles at DOE have been transferred to other government agencies and the few remaining are not issue equipment. All remaining M14 rifles held by DOE were to be eventually transferred to other government agencies. DOE disposal procedures only allow transfer to another government agency or destruction. Those are the only allowable means of reducing weapons inventory for DOE. It remains a mystery as to how but a small number of the USGI M14 rifles formerly held by the DOE were released for sale in the late 1990s to the public. This small lot of USGI M14 rifles was obtained and subsequently sold into the commercial market by Class 3 SOT/FFL businessman F. Charles Logan (Warrendale, PA).
The number of former DOE M14 rifles released for sale has been reported as fifteen by a very credible source. Many of these DOE M14 rifles have the symbol # and a number etched on the left side of the receiver above the stock line. These are DOE weapons chit numbers. The numbers were engraved on the receivers at the direction of the DOE Senior Firearms Advisor at the time, Dave Shannon. A second very credible source has observed one DOE M14 rifle etched with # 29. Another seven of these DOE M14 rifles are etched with the following: # 8, # 10, # 12, # 19, # 21 (H & R serial number 1564367), # 22 (H & R serial number 1566863) and # 34 (Winchester serial number 1117145)."
he had a history of running his mouth and threatening folks , including med care folks, including health care folks at a local hospital where his wife was being treated
his wife had just passed recently from cancer
the rifle had an altered or missing serial number
he also supposedly had molested his daughter,
and they found Cocaine and Maryjane at his house
all this is old news now on several forums,
guy was apparently a bit unstable, maybe from grief , maybe just messed up, and I would guess the weapons charges were the safe bet as far as making any charges stick and getting it done quick
as far as paperwork, any gov MG , if papered, would be on a form 10 (gov only)
there are some out in the registry,
I sold a H&R M14 (bought from the guy we sold it to 20+yrs ago) a couple years go,
form 4 says manufacturer is H&R, and betting there are more that are not built up or made before 1986 guns
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