Universal M1 Carbine

[sirgknight]

I am new to several Carbine forums and am new to this one also. It is my desire to get a consensus on whether (1) I should pull the trigger on a purchase of this rifle and (2) what the maximum offer should be to make the purchase. The rifle is a Universal which was manufactured back in the 80's but is NEW, never been fired, still in the original box with purchase papers for proof. I have done a good bit of research and have discovered that only Universal parts can be used for repair/replacement and that USGI parts are not interchangeable. The research has also uncovered a few serious concerns about Universal including, but not limited to, possible "firing out-of-battery". With all of this said, it seems that the Universal M1 Carbine is also well established on the market. I am looking for a good shooter for my grandson and my funds are somewhat limited. I certainly can't afford a USGI version but I also do not want to risk a questionable purchase on a used non-USGI model. Based on my research it seems that a reasonable offer on a rifle in this condition may be valued at a maximum of $550. I would be very interested in your thoughts or concerns, including any constructive criticism. Thanks.

[Tuna]

My first thoughts on this is NO. On second thought it's NO, NO and NO !!!! The later Universal carbines above the serial number range of 100,000 as know as problems waiting to happen. The company redesigned the major parts on them and that lead to breakage. You cannot get parts for them as the company has been out of business since the 80's and USGI does not interchange as you have found out. Quality control all but disappeared by about the 400,000 mark and the very end of production got dangerous as there was no inspection or control before Iver Johnson shut the production down. Save up your money and get a rebuilt USGI carbine. Will cost more but worth it. Stay away from the likes of the new Inland or the Auto Ordnance. They are again of poor quality. Now if you find a used Plainfield carbine then it's good quality and should give you many years of shooting fun.

[Allen]

The later Universals had some of the nicest, deep bluing I've seen, almost black. That's were it ends though. If memory serves me right you have 40,000psi going off just inches from your eyes if it fires out of battery. Even the stocks will not interchange on the later models.

Like Tuna said, hunt for a Plainfield or a GI model that has the import marks on it as they sell for a little less. Leave the others alone.

Also, welcome to the forum. There's not much going on here anymore but pi$$ing contest over politics so gun discussion is always welcomed too.

[sirgknight]

Thank you very much for the feedback. You can probably tell that I was already on the fence and leaning against the Universal. Practically all of the feedback that I have received is identical so I am definitely marking Universal off of my list. I am Currently looking at a Plainfield with a 4-number serial number. The rifle is part of an estate sale with a purchase price under $600.

[Allen]

Unfortunately you won't find a good one much cheaper but don't pay more for a Plainfield just because it is a 4 digit model as they have no collector value. A lot of Plainfield's come with a ventilated steel handguard. Those can be replaced with the wood GI makes if desired.

Good luck with everything.

[Sunray]

Late model Universals are junk. Mind you, they're fairly reliable junk. Issue with 'em is that no internal issue parts will work. And that the poorly made, stamped, op handles had a tendency to break and are currently irreplaceable. Gunparts bought all the remaining IJ/Universal parts and are sold out of op handles($98.25 each when to do have any and you need to know which barrel you have. Round or flat.). And issue op handles do not fit.
"...a used Plainfield carbine..." All of 'em will be used. And it matters when it was made. Iver Johnson also bought Plainfield and let the QC go. However, a Plainfield Carbine made by the Plainfield Machine Company(had mine for over 40 years and have done absolutely nothing to it but clean it) will give you years of reliable, accurate, shooting pleasure. The Plainfield will use any issue part as it was an exact copy of the issue Carbine.

[sirgknight]

Well, I pulled the trigger on a Plainfield Machine M1 Carbine .30, s/n 41xx. The purchase price was $589. This rifle was part of a fairly large private collection in an estate sale and the lady had no use for her husbands guns since he passed away. The collection was (is) on consignment with a dealer out of Texas. Hope I made the right choice for my grandson. Carbines are getting priced out of sight, especially the USGI guns. Hopefully we will at least be able to finds parts for repair/replacement with the Plainfield. I have an Inland from CMP that was manufactured in 1944 and it has been a great shooter. I think I paid $300 for it but I have had it so long that I can't really remember. Knowing what I know now I would have purchased my yearly limit and held onto 'em. Oh well.......

[Allen]

You did good and the widow got a fair price as well. As you know, from having an Inland, you probably won't ever need replacement parts. But if you do......

[Richard H Brown Jr]

sirgknight:

Did good on the Plainfield, one of the best *repro* versions from the 60's or so. Mosly GI parts with a civilian receiver. I've had one since the early 80's. Only problems I've had were the Bolt hold open didn't hold the op rod back, the milled slot was poorly done and the didn't flat drill the ends so the milled area curves, and with the rounded tip of the hold open pin, if you manage to get the op-rod held, you could slap the stock and the bolt would slam shut. Finally found a GOOD gunsmith with milling equipment, and he milled the slot a little deeper. The other problem I had, was the front sights were loose, and I bought all N.O.S. parts from Numrich and had another smith install the front sight bits, but he didn't do it according to the depot manual. You have to stake the front and back of the slot in the sight base and the key that fits in that slot, so the sights don't move. Found out the hard way, when I tried to adjust the elevation per the Depot manual. You set a special target (in some of the downloadable depot manuals for the carbine) at a distance of 25yrds and fire 9 rnd groups, and then you file the top of the sight blade to move the group into a dotted area on the target, if it's above the dotted area, well, you replace the front sight and start over 8*).

RHB

[Tuna]

You bought a very good Plainfield and it should give you many years of fun shooting. And it uses all USGI parts so your not going to run out of any parts you might ever need.

[sirgknight]

I truly appreciate all of the feedback that I have received in my search for a good shooter for my grandson. Hopefully he will be very surprised and excited to put his eyes on a gun similar to his grandpa's. When he first started shooting my Inland I could tell that there was a special love for that firearm. Every time he visits he asks if he can shoot the "carbine". I knew that I had two choices; give him my Inland or try to find him a good shooter. Since I'm not quite ready to give up on shooting, I decided to start looking. There is no doubt that your feedback played a huge role in making my choice. Let's hope that this Plainfield will do the trick.

[Marty T.]

I may foresee your next problem. Grandson may decide that he wants Grandpa to start helping him with his "collection". If so, have a great time with it, I did (do)!!

[sirgknight]

Don’t know about the collection but I have been doing my own Reloading since the 70s and he’s already hit me up for loading his ammo which I would love to do to teach him this wonderful past time also.

[Allen]

Don’t know about the collection but I have been doing my own Reloading since the 70s and he’s already hit me up for loading his ammo which I would love to do to teach him this wonderful past time also.

Sure. Someone needs to carry on. With reloading comes great responsibility though and the 30 carbine isn't the best cartridge to start with due to the cases stretching so much and needing to be trimmed but it's all a part of it. Glad he is interested.