View Full Version : Inconsistent OAL
The thing that slows down my reloading is inconsistent overall length. I use a Lee press and I’m constantly adjusting the die position. Any recommendations?
what dies are you using?
OAL of the brass, or the loaded round?
type of bullet?
Parashooter
09-25-2019, 07:34
Depends on what and where we're measuring.
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I’m using a Lee Precision press and a RCBS loading die to press in a 30-06 M2 FMJ Flat Based bullet into sized and trimmed case. I set the loading die for the first bullet but have to readjust the loading die for just about every bullet thereafter. They’re either too long or too short. Is it inconsistent bullet shape or slop in their press linkage? I would suspect slop in the press linkage.
start with the basics,
clean the seater die, and look at the seater (where the bullet tips contact and see if it makes a solid contact (preferably around the bullet just below the tip)
make sure the die is secure (basics, something everyone overlooks once in a while), want to make sure it does not turn or wobble
clean the shell holder,
once you have eliminated the simple (and not always obvious stuff) look at the components
OAL consistent on the bullets? may need a comparator on that (to measure from the the same spot on each bullet , not the tip, )
if all those are good, then I would look at a better press, and\or a Benchrest type seater die,
for 30.06 I use a Forster Co-Ax press and an ancient Videcki seater die, no issues using 150's or 168's
This is why you never measure from the bullet TIP to the head of the case!
Measure from the OGIVE to the head of the case.
m1ashooter
09-25-2019, 09:00
What are the overall length of the bullets. I had this issue using cheap GI bullets.
Good suggestions. I will clean the die and shell holder and see what can be done to tighten up the press link slop.
JohnMOhio
09-25-2019, 07:37
When you set your seating stem you do it after finding the longest bullet in the box. Match hollow points vary a great deal in their length to the tip of the bullet. If your seating stem contacts the bullet along the "nose cone" rather than the bullet tip, you will have them all seated the same into the case. The bullet tip length will not make any difference in the function of the firearm. Only time it would have a function problem if your using a magazine such as that for an AR firearm for example. However how close the "nose cone" does make a difference if it is contacting the rifling. What Jim said is correct as well as Lymans suggestion to get a bullet length comparator. Get yourself a Hornady LNL gage. Not that expensive and it does make a difference.
"...have to readjust the loading die..." As in the bullet seater die? Inconsistent lengths usually means the die or seating plug is loose. Mind you, inconsistently raising the ram will do it too
How much is the difference? You do have a tolerance for the OAL. SAAMI Max OAL for the '06 is 3.340" Minimum is 2.940".
"...have to readjust the loading die..." As in the bullet seater die? Inconsistent lengths usually means the die or seating plug is loose. Mind you, inconsistently raising the ram will do it too
How much is the difference? You do have a tolerance for the OAL. SAAMI Max OAL for the '06 is 3.340" Minimum is 2.940".
It’s not much of a difference, maybe a few thousands and the difference is within the min-max specs.
I am not a whiz at any of this, but early on I wondered what the point of OAL was as far as good shooting rouonds. The point of the bullet hangs out in "mid-air" and effects nothing as far as I could tell. I use this guys technique. He's a little repetitive but I do this when I reload for my Swedes and Swiss.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UmlLXary7ss
Johnny P
09-27-2019, 12:22
Unless you are loading so close to maximum length that some cartridges won't enter the magazine, I wouldn't worry about it. Unless you have bunches of slack somewhere, your die should be seating the ogive to the same place and overall length doesn't matter.
Unless you are loading so close to maximum length that some cartridges won't enter the magazine, I wouldn't worry about it. Unless you have bunches of slack somewhere, your die should be seating the ogive to the same place and overall length doesn't matter.
The OAL that I’m trying to achieve is 3.325”. The maximum allowed is 3.334”. My finished product never exceeds 3.325” and I measure every one, but I often get some that are as short as 3.319”. But that is measuring from the head to the tip. The front tip of the case neck is always right within the crimping groove. I was just wondering if the variable was typical.
. . . . .I was just wondering if the variable was typical.
Yup . . . .typical. . . . .
For a surprising “eye-opener”, measure the length of ANY, high-quality, MATCH GRADE bullet that has a hollow point . . . .
Even at this “expensive” level, the bullet OAL will vary . . . considerably!
Under a glass, look at the “ragged” tip of the bullet and you’ll see WHY your cartridge OAL will vary.
Measuring OGIVE to cartridge HEAD is the only way to go!
Johnny P
09-29-2019, 10:50
The OAL that I’m trying to achieve is 3.325”. The maximum allowed is 3.334”. My finished product never exceeds 3.325” and I measure every one, but I often get some that are as short as 3.319”. But that is measuring from the head to the tip. The front tip of the case neck is always right within the crimping groove. I was just wondering if the variable was typical.
You are trying to do something that is of no importance as long as the loaded cartridge will function in the rifle. As mentioned by JimF, the HP match bullet is formed from the base forward, and this leaves the tip of the bullet somewhat irregular. A slight irregularity at the base of the bullet affects accuracy, but a slight irregularity at at the tip doesn't.
By setting the OAL as the criteria, you are changing the distance the bullet is off the rifling.
It is amazing how uninformed reloaders can be. If you are depending on OAL for accuracy your pi**ing into the wind. The tip of the bullet can be as out there as Pinocchios nose and, with in reason, not make any difference. A lot of reloading is Voodoo. Bullets make a difference.
JohnMOhio
01-04-2020, 11:56
Merc, have you checked your primers. They may not be seated the same. Just a thought.
Most loading charts post a min OAL in their specs for a specific bullet. This is to assure the loader that he is not placing too much of the bullet in the case and thereby increasing pressures to a dangerous level. Setting up seating dies should be done using proper measuring tools that read Base to Ogive and then decisions need to be made as to the distance from ogive to lands. It's not rocket science, but a lot of us get it wrong.
what dies are you using?
OAL of the brass, or the loaded round?
I have case length when measured from the end of the neck to the case head, I have a measurement that is taken from the datum to the case head; when added the two lengths do not add up the overall length of the case. When I seat a bullet in the case I have a length from the top of the bullet to the case head, when I want COl (case overall length) I measure from the top of the bullet to the case head.
The case does not have 'overall' without the bullet.
F. Guffey
but a lot of us get it wrong.
One say someone is going to suggest 'the lot of you' to quit kicking the can down the road.
The ogive measurement from the ogive to the case head is another measurement.
F. Guffey
Parashooter
01-06-2020, 06:50
. . . when I want COl (case overall length) I measure from the top of the bullet to the case head.
The case does not have 'overall' without the bullet. . .
I think someone is confused.
"COL" generally means Cartridge Overall Length - logically enough, since case length is only one component of that dimension. The "Overall" part means "all elements, including case and seated bullet" - of the assembly known as a cartridge.
Since we don't have a "like" button; Guffey is correct
Since we don't have a "like" button; Guffey is correct
Thank you; we have so many reloaders on all forums that are self designated experts that have learned all they know from the Internet.
F. Guffey
Thank you; we have so many reloaders on all forums that are self designated experts that have learned all they know from the Internet.
F. Guffey
What's an Internet? Humor
What's an Internet? Humor
hee hee
https://pics.me.me/thumb_every-thing-you-see-in-the-internet-is-100-true-52942541.png
Don't believe anything you hear, and only half what you see.
46900
46901
What's an Internet? Humor
Quote Originally Posted by fguffey View Post
Thank you; we have so many reloaders on all forums that are self designated experts that have learned all they know from the Internet.
There was an Internet reloader that covered the reloading forums like the wind; he did not own a press but reloaders bowed to him, when forced to get technical he got angry.
Needless to say reloaders were scared of him.
F. Guffey
Got it. I call that type the" Boogie Woogie Google Boys". The world is full of ex-spurts.
Expert....
Ex = has been
Pert (pronounced "spert") = a drip under hi pressure
Got it. I call that type the" Boogie Woogie Google Boys". The world is full of ex-spurts.
They exist because most reloaders are enablers, they facilitate the behavior. there was one forum that was made up of bench resters. I had no interest in the forum because of their child like behavior; and then one day one of the members on that forum aske me if I would come over and make an attempt to get rid of him. They had the bad habit of informing those 'with thin skin' to go somewhere else.
They reminded me of Alabama Leg Dogs, I gained experience dealing with Alabama Leg Dogs because I owned 2 of them, Most of my help came from Alabama, her name was Sally. Her first customer was Little Johnny, his dog was named Spot. Old Spot was like a lot of people I know (she said) and that is the reason a lot of reloaders on reloader forums remind me of Alabama Leg Dogs.
F. Guffey
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