1917 Enfield Stock Marking Question

[w10085]

I know this is a 1903 forum but this was the closest I could find. Has anybody ever seen a 1917 stock with an "O" on the tip? The picture may look like a C but it's an O. It has the WWI eagle head marks on the bottom and no rebuild marks. I see references to W, E and R that are obivious but never an O for this time frame. The WWI eagles mean it's not a WWII replacement stock. Any ideas? Thanks in advance!4884648847

[cowtownscout]

There is a 1917 forum below.


thanks, I moved it

[w10085]

Thanks for the move. I missed the 1917 forum. I didn't scrol down enough.

[Merc]

Odd replacement stocks occasionally turn up on ‘17s. Some stocks with a “T” on the front tip have been seen.

[w10085]

Interesting. I had not heard that. I thought the eagle head proofs made it original issue not a replacement.

[Merc]

The following paragraph was taken directly from a book titled: “United States Rifle Model of 1917” that was written by CS Ferris and is available on Amazon and eBay.

Manufacturer Marks (Page 89)

Stock. The three manufacturers, Eddystone, Remington and Winchester applied their initial, E, R or W, to the fore-end of the stock. Winchester often also applied a Winchester sub-inspector’s number as well. Stocks made by other firms were designated for marking as follows: N for New England Westinghouse, B for Remington Arms U.M.C. Bridgeport, V for Victor Talking Machine Co., and A for Wood-Art Machine Co. This was after the Armistice, when contracts were being cancelled. Whether stocks made by other firms were actually used on accepted rifles is not known by the author.

Obviously, some vendor made stocks made their way onto a ‘17 here and there. My early Winchester ‘17 wears a “T” stamped stock that appears newish. The finger grooves were sanded smooth and I always wondered if that was from an overzealous refinisher or factory fresh until I saw an identical T stamped stock on a ‘17 at a gun show a few years ago that was in similar condition.

[fjruple]

Merc-- I suspect that Eddystone was using subcontractors in the Philadelphia/southern NJ Area to supply rifle stocks for the production rate they were achieving in WWI. The Victor Talking Machine Company located in Camden, NJ (Later Victorola/RCA Victor) commercially high end phonographs (Record players) for the public. These phonographs had wooden cabinets made of American Black Walnut. I personally have been in the building where they made. RCA was sold to the French many years ago and the building with its iconic dog listening to his master's vioce is still there. (replica of course) The building is now a number of high end apartments. The Wood-Art Machine Company was better known for manufacture of a Springfield M1903 training rifle for the US Navy under the US Training Rifle Company, Philadelphia, PA. Even though the training rifle has a Philadelphia, PA address the training rifles were actually built in Woodbury, NJ. That location is just North of me. The location later was owned by Forway Industries, a Defense contractor, which was involved with Ollie North and the Iran-Contra Affair. The building is still there and was converted into apartments as well. I suspect that since they were making M1903 style wooden stocks they were also subcontracted to produce wooden stocks for Eddystone. The one thing we have to bear in mind is the number of rifles being produced by Eddystone not just the M1917 but the earlier Pattern 1914 .303 British rifle as well from 1916 to early 1919. In that space of short time plus several months off awaiting the final approval of the blueprint drawings for the M1917, Eddystone produced close to 2 million rifles for the British and US military. A production feat that I do not believe that has been match by old wood and steel gun production.

[Merc]

Good information.

[JB White]

I had a Remington with an R "heart" on the forend tip. A clearly stamped heart like a Valentines Day heart.
So far this seems to be a mystery marking. Only one other spotted over the years. If anyone knows the significance....?

[fjruple]

JB-- I believe the heart was a Remington inspector's marking. I have seen that marking on other Remington rifles.

[JB White]

That seems to be the most plausible reason for its being. You have seen them too which reinforces the fact they're out there. Yet its an 'undocumented' marking as far as I can tell.
If it were a production marking you'd think someone would have listed it before our time.

[RC20]

Great information from all, well done!

As noted, the production numbers were beyond belief for any mfg of anything let alone WWI and the hand labor as well as the industry problem with employees period let alone capable or qualified ones.

Equally, this was not done to anyone's satisfaction but the inspector to ensure that the guns met specs.

Another adder is this was not a Government operation so records keeping during and post was not in the cards.

Its amazing what we do have and the fact of some oddities getting into the system would be expected.

Lo many years latter we would like a clear documentation and process but it was not setup for that, its purpsoe was simply to make guns that satisfied the inspectors and agreements and clearly they were extraordinary successful in the face of huge adversity.