View Full Version : Annealing today.
Running a few trays of DAG 93 and MEN 94 once fired, sized, trimmed and tumbled cases through the Giraud annealer today. Takes about 10 seconds per case to get where I like it.
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After annealing inspection showed up a few of the corroded cases. This was a batch of about 2000 once fired and these went to file 13.
49422
Very nice set up, I'm still using a torch, pencil, pan of water and sweat.
Any you probably enjoy doing it. That's what really counts in the end.
After annealing inspection showed up a few of the corroded cases. This was a batch of about 2000 once fired and these went to file 13.
I have never seen cases with metal eating termites.
F. Guffey
First time for almost everything.
First time for almost everything.
Through the power of suggestion I believe there will be a rash of reporting's. I am sure you have more cases than I do and you have been doing this thing called reloading much longer that I have, it just goes to show how unfair reloading is. I have gone through many batches of cases from 800, 1400, 2400 etc.. cases, all before the year 1954 without finding cases I had to kick to the side because of isolated corrosion.
All the cases I have found damaged was done by me.
F. Guffey
Very nice set up, I'm still using a torch, pencil, pan of water and sweat.
BudT, I have close to 25 temp-sticks that cover a wide range of temperatures, I also have a pyrometer that has 6 positions, I no longer use it or the sticks but I have them 'just in case'. What seems like a long time ago I made tools for annealing; I thought there should be a set of rules that basically covered annealing, the rules only apply to my tools. But, the process of annealing differs in a few small ways from the method you use.
F. Guffey
Major Tom
07-20-2021, 05:20
I have never annealed any brass. Am I doing something wrong? Or missing an important step in reloading? I have reloaded since 1967 with many different calibers. So, what brass condition would requier annealing?
You are not doing anything wrong. I find that the annealing on the precision stuff adds to a much more consistent neck tension. Personally, yes I consider annealing a very important factor. Got a few years on you loading. My old guru was a bench rest shooter and , I think, he broke me in right.
Parashooter
07-20-2021, 10:10
I have never annealed any brass. Am I doing something wrong? Or missing an important step in reloading? I have reloaded since 1967 with many different calibers. So, what brass condition would requier annealing?
Apart from precision considerations, cases that have been sized, reloaded, and fired several times may crack due to a loss of plasticity from the cold forming the neck experiences. Annealing restores plasticity and can help extend longevity of the remaining cases in a batch that exhibits cracks in one or more specimens. Some handloaders anneal cases preemptively before any cracks appear, keeping track of how many times they have been reloaded and estimating how many uses are likely before any fail from neck fatigue. This number will vary depending on chamber/die dimensions, pressure, brass composition, previous annealing, etc..
49447
Recently had about 25% neck splits on brandy new Lapua brass loads. I annealed the remainder and have gone through 3 successive loadings with no more failures. Fully intend to anneal all the new brass in the stash from now on before loading.
49448
I have never annealed any brass. Am I doing something wrong? Or missing an important step in reloading? I have reloaded since 1967 with many different calibers. So, what brass condition would require annealing?
reloaders can make most of this stuff up; Bart B. claimed he got 45 firings out of full load 308Ws. All I wanted to know was the weight of the cases when he started and the weight when he finished and he did not have a clue; and he never found it necessary to trim the cases. Point? Bart B. is exempt from annealing.
Most reloaders claim they load and fire cases until the necks start to split. To prevent the necks from splitting, anneal the case necks. After that we have reloaders that claim they anneal after each firing, others claim they anneal the necks after 3 firings.
I have had 7mm57 and 8mm57 rifles, I did not shoot one of them, I shot all of them. That included 7.65mm53 B. M. rifles. I off set the expense of cases by forming. that included forming 308W cases from 30/06 cases.
Forming works the brass, I tried to form 7MM57 cases from 30/06 cases, they looked great but if I did not anneal the necks the necks would split after seating a bullet, they did not split immediately but over time. The generous neck diameter of the chamber worked the case neck even more. A knowledgeable case former can off set the difference when tightening the neck in the chamber.
Back to "I have never annealed any brass"; there is why and there is how. What seems like a long time ago I decided there should be rules to annealing, I gave everyone time to contribute, time ran out so I had to go with 'my rules'. I made a few tools that were based on the rules, nothing complicated.
So, what brass condition would require annealing?
I have formed 30/06 cases (necked up) many cases to 35 Whelen and 338/06, I have also used 280 Remington cases for long 30/06 chambers. Annealing the necks on all of these cases increase the number of times they can be fired before splitting.
F. Guffey
My annealing rig is a mapp-pro torch in a hobbyist vise and an aluminum sleeve made from scrap. The sleeve has a screw poking through one end to chuck into a drill. The sleeve is there to protect the case head and most of the body from accidental flame exposure.
It's all done at low light on the basement floor, nothing flammable nearby. Stick the case in the sleeve, spin it with the drill while putting the case mouth in the flame for a few Mississippis. Let that case cool on the slab. Surprisingly little heat is needed and if the neck is dimly glowing that is plenty.
Brass does not need to be quenched and the hotter flame requires less exposure time.
Do 1000 in a batch? Heck no but for converting a batch of cal .30 to 8mm it makes resizing go like slicing warm butter.
Off-topic addition, annealing copper washers that come with automotive brake hoses and calipers makes getting a leak free seal so much easier.
Brass does not need to be quenched and the hotter flame requires less exposure time.
I agree, brass does not have to be quenched, I quench my cases, I do not stand the case up in a pan, if I did and in the process i kicked the cases over it would slow me down. And then if I told someone 'WHY' it would bore them and then the arguments would start.
Again, I made a few annealing tools, I went to the Dallas Market Hall Gun Show and set a few of the tools on a table, most thought I was trying to sell them. Mo one was interested in how the tools was used; they only wanted to tell me how they annealed cases. Then they wanted to tell me everything they knew and quenching, and I asked; "is there anything you could possibly learn from it?"
What ever it was they were doing they did not know why.
F. Guffey
Annealing or hardening can be tricky. Here is a vid by one of the coolest guys in the world. He will try anything but isn't a Here Hold my beer kind of guy.
Go a little past 1/2 way in the vid.
https://www.bing.com/videos/search?q=outdoor+boys+youtube&&view=detail&mid=4829A94648AA842FD2C14829A94648AA842FD2C1&&FORM=VRDGAR&ru=%2Fvideos%2Fsearch%3Fq%3Doutdoor%2Bboys%2Byoutu be%26qpvt%3Doutdoor%2Bboys%2Byoutube%26FORM%3DVDRE
I agree, brass does not have to be quenched, I quench my cases, I do not stand the case up in a pan, if I did and in the process i kicked the cases over it would slow me down. And then if I told someone 'WHY' it would bore them and then the arguments would start.
Again, I made a few annealing tools, I went to the Dallas Market Hall Gun Show and set a few of the tools on a table, most thought I was trying to sell them. Mo one was interested in how the tools was used; they only wanted to tell me how they annealed cases. Then they wanted to tell me everything they knew and quenching, and I asked; "is there anything you could possibly learn from it?"
What ever it was they were doing they did not know why.
F. Guffey
Guffy good posts! But, I do have a question. You made tools specific to your process and put them on display. Did you have pictures showing how they were used in your process? Can't open a dialogue about annealing unless both sides have a starting point.
You said your process works for you; evidently the others felt their process worked for them. There are many ways to anneal, as you said, your "rules" are for you. It seems there are more rules on what to avoid when annealing, red glow is too hot, don't overanneal, stay away from the head, etc. As long as these "rules" are not violated successful annealing will be the result.
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