View Full Version : In a "close encounter" (within the house) what would you use ...
I'm talking bullet choice.
I live in a very safe neighborhood but just in case I keep a loaded
but not cocked 03 Colt in 32 in my computer desk drawer.
It was loaded with Winchester silver tips but I changed over to FMJs
thinking that a few feet distance an expanding bullet would not have
enough oomph behind it to actually expand. A bullet is a bullet
however so I'm pretty sure the difference would be negligible.
I'm just thinking aloud really.
So, am I right, wrong or what ? Whatdoya think ?
My house gun is a .357 Magnum S&W Highway Patrolman so I'm at the other end from you.
However:
The .32 acp has plenty of "ooomph" to expand a Silver Tip out of that M1903 at any distance in your house unless you live in Versailles. With a good hollow point the .32 acp should be adequate. With fmj its marginal at best. I'd get a different pistol rather than use fmj. The real question is will Silvertips function reliably in your pistol. You'll need to put a couple of magazines through it to be sure. I have shot a full magazine of Silvertips through an M1903 and they worked fine but YMMV.
This video is like watching paint dry but its a decent depiction of .32 acp performance. Your M1903 will give at least 100 fps over that micro .380.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aQ84HrlYbtk
Oh, don't forget to rack that slide!!!
I have more powerful handguns but I like the 03. I just hope the instruder is small
as I doubt a linebacker would be deterred by a puny 32. (Cooper would call it a Mouse Gun)
hmmmm
depends on which room I am in,
I do carry a 1903 sometimes, and it has silver tips in it,
my seecamp has them as well,
the 45's have hydra shoks,, IIRC,
the 357 has Winchester LEO loads, cannot remember the grain weight,
my P6, only ball ammo, but I don't really carry it any longer
the 228 has silvertips,
the J frame has Hornady Critical Defense,
and the shotguns are birdshot, cause I have a lot,
good enough?
I'm impressed. Actually the 32 is the only firearm readily to hand.
The others are in the safe. I have ammo handy for my BP rifles, but they'd
be a bit less than wieldy in a room to room scenario.
sorry Dogtag, I was off
the 228 has Black Talon's in it
I'm impressed. Actually the 32 is the only firearm readily to hand.
The others are in the safe. I have ammo handy for my BP rifles, but they'd
be a bit less than wieldy in a room to room scenario.
I keep one on each floor, and rotate a few as carry pieces,
got a few stashed at the shop as well, but they are all loaded with ball
- - - Updated - - -
I'm impressed. Actually the 32 is the only firearm readily to hand.
The others are in the safe. I have ammo handy for my BP rifles, but they'd
be a bit less than wieldy in a room to room scenario.
btw,, that Colt is a fantastic carry piece,
I had a first model, (with the bushing) that I carried a bit, but while is showed wear, it was all original finish,
so I sold it off after I found the next generation or model, that someone had messed with the finish, (looked like an old reblue )
pocket and holster wear may improve the looks over time,
sights suck,, but if you tombstone it like you do a Seecamp, then it is actually pretty accurate
one shot
12-30-2021, 04:59
16 ga model 12 winchester loaded with number 5 shot , slam fire that gun will stop anybody without going to far , in the yard the dogs are let loose they will have fun .
Started carrying years ago doing night security in a shipyard in New Orleans. Little Ruger Mk II was what I could afford. Right now ... it'd have to do. It'd do the job. Sincerely. bruce.
JB White
12-31-2021, 09:02
In both the 38spc and 357 mag.
Ammo for close quarters inside the home.
38spc 158 gr LSWCHP +P.
It?s serious enough medicine that does the job as intended.
I know all about the 357 mag loadings and their capabilities. I also prefer to hear again someday.
I have a few Rossi 88's (2" SS) and 357's scattered in the house all loaded with 38spl +P.
Inside your home you don't want something that's going to penetrate one wall and go into another yet you want something that will do the "job".
barretcreek
12-31-2021, 02:31
One of those AOW .410 pumps.
jon_norstog
01-01-2022, 12:22
I'm talking bullet choice.
I live in a very safe neighborhood but just in case I keep a loaded
but not cocked 03 Colt in 32 in my computer desk drawer.
It was loaded with Winchester silver tips but I changed over to FMJs
thinking that a few feet distance an expanding bullet would not have
enough oomph behind it to actually expand. A bullet is a bullet
however so I'm pretty sure the difference would be negligible.
I'm just thinking aloud really.
So, am I right, wrong or what ? Whatdoya think ?
Dogtag, when I lived in So. Philly I used to frequent a speakeasy across the street. I still remember a conversation about just this topic. It went around for a while but the consensus was a .32 was best. "Doesn't make as much of a mess in your house, and with any luck the guy will go die somewhere else."
jn
.32 ACP kilt a lot of europeans
jjrothWA
01-01-2022, 08:01
Sound like yo have the best available, work with it
Best to confirm the silvertips will feed thru the 03 Colt.
If the secondary firearm are available, upgrade IF you can.
My house gun is couple of J-frames with old Hornady 140 gr Xtps, that shoot to POA. followed up with old WIn 97, with the hammered eared back reminds me of a German Shepard ready to GO.
good luck and hope you DON'T need to use.
I will tell the burglar, I hate loud noise, please don't make me shoot you. It's a ploy.
We just had a news production where a home owner with a pistol confronted a burglar who had hit twenty homes in a block or two. Homeless guy. The HO had it all on his commonly available secuirity camera. Somehow he danced arouond with the perp until he got away. Not saying that wasn't the best alternative. The guy has flameing red hair and a huge tattoo on his neck. OK, all the scumbags have tattoos but I figure they will round him up eventually.
My near the bed midnight break in gun is a old but reliable single shot 12 gauge 18 inch, open bore barrel, shotgun loaded with #8 shot.
My carry gun is a S&W Airweight .38 spl.
My car gun is a CZ-83 with 2-12 round mag.
blackhawknj
01-06-2022, 04:15
The current argument against "small bores", FMJs, is over penetration of drywall, etc., ineffective against assailants under the influence, against hollow points, underpenetration of thick clothing, etc.
My bedside guns?-my 6" Ruger Stainless Security and my 6" S&W M-28 loaded with a good 38. Their heft means a follow up shot will be much easier, at the 10-12' distances in my apartment I think a 38 has plenty of anchoring power-and that long barrel has a greater intimidation factor.
After having my front door kicked in and being robbed at gun point I vowed that the next time I would not be an unarmed victim. Beside gun is a 1911 loaded with Black Talon, computer gun is a Commander with Black Talon, chairside gun is a Hi-Power with Rem. 124 gr HP. Downstairs are various handguns in the safes loaded with either Black Talon or, if 9mm loaded with Rem. HP. Hanging on the wall next to the gun room door is an FN FAL with ball ammo. In a wall rack are a Win M12 with buckshot and an M1 Carbine with 110 gr. soft points. All guns have been tested with what they are loaded with. Not too long ago I quit taking a gun with me to the bathroom, but still will bring one most of the time when I take a shower. Usually it is the Nickle Commander.
After having my front door kicked in and being robbed at gun point I vowed that the next time I would not be an unarmed victim. Beside gun is a 1911 loaded with Black Talon, computer gun is a Commander with Black Talon, chairside gun is a Hi-Power with Rem. 124 gr HP. Downstairs are various handguns in the safes loaded with either Black Talon or, if 9mm loaded with Rem. HP. Hanging on the wall next to the gun room door is an FN FAL with ball ammo. In a wall rack are a Win M12 with buckshot and an M1 Carbine with 110 gr. soft points. All guns have been tested with what they are loaded with. Not too long ago I quit taking a gun with me to the bathroom, but still will bring one most of the time when I take a shower. Usually it is the Nickle Commander.
Wow, sorry this happened to you. Thanks for replying. This is what this thread is all about--our worse fears/possibilities.
You may want to consider an additional gun to keep in the bathroom. An experienced robber would know to listen for the shower knowing you or your wife would be defenseless during that time.
I have Glocks, 1911's, M4's, carbines and other semi auto's but prefer to keep a revolver, bolt action, pump or lever action handy for emergencies. I've always had bad luck with auto's jamming at the worse possible time. Also, leaving a mag loaded, even partially loaded, weakens the mag springs over time and hopefully that would be a very long time as most of us will never have to use them against an intruder (hopefully). Of course this is just my preference though.
blackhawknj
01-06-2022, 05:26
Often seems like a HiPoint would be a good choice. They are reliable and if they are taken as "evidence" you won't be crying the blues.
Meaning, you didn't set up some kind of Killer round? It sounds like lawyer and you have to be careful of that. Just thinking about lawyer could get you in trouble. There was a great old western about a bunch of kids who got rescued. At one point a kid whacked a bad guy. The patron says,"did you want to kill him"? Sure! says the kid. Maybe not that funny in script but it's a great line in the movie.
jon_norstog
01-08-2022, 07:22
Kabar.
I'm gonna go (actually have gone, these many years) with an edged weapon as well. Keeping a firearm safe, especially with kids in the house, I think a blade is gonna get into action quicker.
jn
barretcreek
01-09-2022, 10:12
I'm gonna go (actually have gone, these many years) with an edged weapon as well. Keeping a firearm safe, especially with kids in the house, I think a blade is gonna get into action quicker.
jn
Maybe a kiddie compound bow (20-30#) or a spear/bayonet on an old plugged gun. I want distance between me and a hopped up younger assailant.
Maybe a kiddie compound bow (20-30#) or a spear/bayonet on an old plugged gun. I want distance between me and a hopped up younger assailant.
Then again the claim by law enforcement is that an edged weapon is more dangerous at 5 paces than a handgun. For more distance you could use an old school bayo or machete.
Then again the claim by law enforcement is that an edged weapon is more dangerous at 5 paces than a handgun. For more distance you could use an old school bayo or machete.
it's not a claim, it has been proven, there are tons of videos out there showing a person can advance with a knife it the time it takes to drawn and shoot,
however,
in the house, things go bump in the night, and I feel the need to go for a looksee, that firearm is not going to be in a holster,
BTW,, if you have lived in a place more than a week, you should know the layout, and where anyone would be , family wise,
can you walk from room to room, upstairs and down, on a moonless night, no nightlights, in your house now?
with out turning stuff over?
Yes the house is a lot less cluttered now. And remember a handgun in a dark house can easily miss in the same lighting conditions that can cause someone to stumble on a vacuum cleaner left out, and muzzle flash may not be your friend.
So another note of agreement on the value edged weapons for close home defense, with the caveat that a person has to be physically up for it and have some proficiency. Not everyone likes their odds there so people need to do what they need to do.
I think it is safe to assume that an intruder breaking into your home knowing there are people present is going to be armed with something.
If he has a weapon me or the police may search for it after I blow his chit away with a gun.
Defend yourself with only a knife in the dark not knowing what the intruder is armed with? Not for me.
blackhawknj
01-09-2022, 06:14
Yes, an M-1 or an AR-15 with a bayonet. I went through BCT at Fort Dix Summer of 1967-WHAT'S THE SPIRIT OF THE BAYONET !!!!!
- with the caveat that a person has to be physically up for it and have some proficiency. And the mentality. I'm squimish about blood. There must be some research on the exponential easiness of shooting someone, depended on the distance from the shootee. Drive by shootings are way too easy.
I can throw a knife pretty well, but not 100% well. A machete can chop someone up a lot. I don't want to have to butcher a human.
I'm hard of hearing already, it's a ton of paperwork. If I can't get my muffs on I hope I never have to shoot someone.
Let the perp know you mean business. Get the upper hand. Act like a cop; hollar real loud. Act like your crazy. But if it's mental/drugs there might not be any reasoning.
I hate 12 gauge. I could crank out the 20 gauge real fast. And old time Win '97 just sounds like you mean business.
Some kids were ringing doorbells(five real fast like an alarm. I kind of figured kids). I had the .45 with me when I opened the door. After a minute they (not seeing me in the shadows) came out of the bushes across the street and started walking. I safely racked the slide and those kids scadadeled like rabbits. Big thrill for them. Fun for me. No harm done.
Yes, an M-1 or an AR-15 with a bayonet. I went through BCT at Fort Dix Summer of 1967-WHAT'S THE SPIRIT OF THE BAYONET !!!!!
can you have an AR with bayo lug in NJ?
can you have an AR with bayo lug in NJ?
Wow, that would be dangerous. Personally, I'd rather be shot than stuck.
The thought of being bayoneted is horrifying.
Neither is preferable.
jjrothWA
01-16-2022, 11:51
Recommend that the M1 Carbine, take some fine emery paper wrapped around a dowel and lightly polish the feed-ramp, to minimize "stuttering" of soft-nose ammo.
Vern Humphrey
01-18-2022, 04:15
I recommend a 12-gauge pump with Number 4 buckshot,
Ok if you don't move and wait for the intruder to come to you.
But if you have to go room to room looking for intruder, then
a long barrel could prove to be awkward.
Ok if you don't move and wait for the intruder to come to you.
But if you have to go room to room looking for intruder, then
a long barrel could prove to be awkward.
Going room to room isn't necessarily the best idea, bunkering up is generally the recommended approach. If you are going to go through your place "cutting pie" you are right, shorter is better.
Going room to room isn't necessarily the best idea, bunkering up is generally the recommended approach. If you are going to go through your place "cutting pie" you are right, shorter is better.
I don't see this happening either, even on TV.
An intruder entering a home with occupants intends to do bodily harm otherwise they would wait till the house is empty. They will most likely come into your bedroom in the darkness while you are asleep, groggy or otherwise helpless. Putting a bright light or lazar beam on them is not always the answer as they can just shoot at the light and kill the light holder but still you should be 100% certain that your target is someone you want to blast.
If, after shooting at them, if they are able to flee, let them go. Call the police. Hunting for them room to room with the possiblity of getting ambushed in my own home would not happen.
As far as long guns go, I've read where the M1 carbine is much more preferred over an AR-15 due to the larger projectile and less wall penetration. However, nothing puts the fear into someone as the sound of the cocking of a pump shotgun. They know you mean business.
The each his own, everyones situation is going to be different along with what guns they have to use.
Not to say the sky is falling but everyone should think about such a scenario actually happening and how to plan for it, not just for yourself but your wife and others in the house.
A few short years ago this subject would have been considered useless drama. Now living in lawless democrat cities and states it's just a matter of who's turn is it next.
. . . . .Putting a bright light or lazar beam on them is not always the answer as they can just shoot at the light and kill the light holder . . . . . .
Right on, Allen . . . .
Way back, when I was a LEO, our training officer told us to extend the left arm/hand holding the flashlight out to left (if right-handed) as far as possible, with the firearm in the right hand, for exactly that reason!
Right on, Allen . . . .
Way back, when I was a LEO, our training officer told us to extend the left arm/hand holding the flashlight out to left (if right-handed) as far as possible, with the firearm in the right hand, for exactly that reason!
Part of "Murhpy's Laws of War;" Tracers work both ways...
Part of "Murhpy's Laws of War;" Tracers work both ways...
Don't tracers need a pretty good distance before they burn through and start to trace?
Don't tracers need a pretty good distance before they burn through and start to trace?
In my limited experience they seem to ignite pretty quickly. When I was in the Army in Korea our M60s were loaded with ball. I remember in basic training that part of the course where you crawl under wire with machine guns shooting over your head I could see the tracers coming in clearly and could tell where they were coming from.
The point was almost anything you use to follow your fire, track or illuminate your adversary may also gives away your position.
In my limited experience they seem to ignite pretty quickly.
In a house though? Average bedroom wall to wall distance is probably 12' or so.
I understand the logic though: If they can see you, you can see them.
In a house though? Average bedroom wall to wall distance is probably 12' or so.
I understand the logic though: If they can see you, you can see them.
I wasn't referring literally to tracers for in home use but things like laser attachments and flashlights.
jon_norstog
01-31-2022, 11:28
Shooting tracers in your house! What could POSSIBLY go wrong?
jn
milboltnut
02-10-2022, 08:08
357/38 loaded with .38 Hornady critical defense. Can't use Hollow point ammo. So the FTX isn't a hollow point but expand like one.
357/38 loaded with .38 Hornady critical defense. Can't use Hollow point ammo. So the FTX isn't a hollow point but expand like one.
Federal "Guard Dog" ammunition is a FMJ that "expands." Available in 9mm, .40S&W and .45 ACP. Well worth a look for those in jurisdictions where use of JHP ammo is illegal. Sincerely. bruce.
blackhawknj
02-11-2022, 11:40
Yes, tracers were developed to shoot down zeppelins, later found to help pilots correct their aim and ignite an enemy's fuel tanks. Their value for ground troops is extremely limited.
In "Close Encounters of the Worst Kind" in a home environment, I firmly believe that Speed and Power are fine but Accuracy's final.
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