Ramrod bayonet Trapdoor rifle information

[cessnapilot89]

Hello all, I recently acquired an 1888 trapdoor and was told I should ask questions about it here. The SN is 517439 and has an 1891 acceptance mark on the stock. What attracted me to the rifle was the condition and the markings on the stock. 65 over 592. Does anyone have any insight into that? Would something like that be covered in the SRS?

Inside the stock was a pattern 1879 tool, but I'm unsure how to actually use it.

[JimF]

Go here for many answers to your questions:

The U.S. Springfield Trapdoor Rifle Information Center (http://trapdoorcollector.com/)

Spend a rainy day perusing this ENTIRE website!

[cessnapilot89]

Thank you!

[Dick Hosmer]

The 1879 tool comprises two screwdrivers, a mainspring clamp, a tumbler punch, and a band-spring punch.

IF you need to dismount the lock, after CAREFULLY removing it from the stock (which you should NOT do unless you NEED to), you bring the hammer to full cock and slip the notch in the tool over the compressed mainspring, then let the hammer down and the spring can be wiggled off the plate. Set it aside, as it needs to be reinstalled with the spring compressed. To separate the hammer, set the lock on a couple of small wooden blocks, remove the hammer screw (It helps to have TWO M1879 tools (they are cheap and handy) or you could remove said screw earlier. The large blade on the tool is nicely curved so as not to slip. Stick the pin into the screw hole - you will note that there is a shoulder which just spans the width of the tumbler shank. Take a hammer and strike the little bulge on the side of the tool opposite the punch. The whole idea is to drive the tumbler out of the hammer - NEVER, EVER, attempt to pry the hammer off from the lock plate side.

You should NEVER want to remove a band spring, but if you do, the little pin on the tool will get it started properly, rather than using a nail and buggering things up. Be VERY careful of chipping the wood when removing ANY metal component inletted into it. The nicer the gun, the more this applies . . .

[cessnapilot89]

Thank you so much everyone! Do you know where I can buy a copy of the SRS data so I can look up the Serial Number?

[Dick Hosmer]

Long out of print and very expensive (often over $100 per each of the 5 books) THEN you have to take the 20-1 gamble that your gun is among the 5% with something known about it! There is no longer any continuous production record - they were destroyed LONG ago.

Just post the number and one of us with the books will check.

[45govt]

Hello
This database is searchable

https://www.ebay.com/itm/265799660168?hash=item3de2e4f288:g:bOMAAOSwUU9i4Zd f&amdata=enc%3AAQAHAAAAoHhumsaln9y4wQTRc226o7%2BXPJO QH1ZU2KcscE5eDg28P6LAiEUqChhIPovdKLXh97HeUAQA8lD33 gj4B7%2BJAlM8r0LYnkSBs02eau0RYd%2FsIlxava80ZR%2BCc WuiZhGan37v1ZoRpUsHdYKI%2BaYc%2BLzw2vgCGFpWssO4KZe yvyxAYxBoSC%2FN3wDj8z9wUn6KmbMCt2D9fm212t0SP%2FDbb oA%3D%7Ctkp%3ABk9SR9LnucfbYA

[Dick Hosmer]

I believe the seller of the thumb-drive is a bald-faced LIAR, and the item should be withdrawn from sale for copyright infringement.

Several statements in his VERY amateurish, and overly hyped, description do not ring true at all, and the format shown is an EXACT copy of the SRS layout. How is that if it isn't SOME sort of scan? If it was fresh work, as claimed, then WHY be so stupid as to duplicate the original.

I'd guess it's the same kinda guy that sells repro inspector cartouche stamping dies.

[cessnapilot89]

Thank you all for the help! I would hate to buy a boot leg copy and support illegal acts.

[Tom Trevor]

No SRS listing for your serial number.

[45govt]

From the National Archives website.

"Materials created and produced by United States federal agencies, or by an officer or employee of the United States Government as part of that person's official duties, are considered works of the United States Government. These works are not eligible for copyright protection, in the United States, and are treated as though they are in the public domain."

[Dick Hosmer]

Is the seller such a person?

Did he "create and produce" the item on question, or did he copy the work of others - and by that I do NOT mean the unsung clerks of the 19th century upon whom we all rely?

If he did the work on government time, then the money obtained from any sales should go to the taxpayers. Is that happening here?

I find it VERY interesting to be involved in this discussion, because I, personally, have used material from the SRS books (which I contributed to, as well as buying and paying for my copies) in my book "More .45-70 Springfields, 1873-1893". There were some differences, however. I gave FULL credit to SRS, and I ONLY extracted the serial numbers (which themselves are NOT copyrightable) taking none of the researched data or tabular format.

I STILL think I smell a rat here.

[Carlsr]

Dick, those books are priced well over 100.00. The lowest priced copy I purchased was 175 and the others were much higher. The 1999 edition is listed at 500 to 550 on able books, think that’s were I seen them??? However I was not that desperate and luckily found it much lower elsewhere.
I do also have the thumb drive which I copped to my computer and then downloaded it to my phone so no need to carry those valuable books around.

[Dick Hosmer]

Dick, those books are priced well over 100.00. The lowest priced copy I purchased was 175 and the others were much higher. The 1999 edition is listed at 500 to 550 on able books, think that’s were I seen them??? However I was not that desperate and luckily found it much lower elsewhere.
I do also have the thumb drive which I copped to my computer and then downloaded it to my phone so no need to carry those valuable books around.

Yeah - who knew? If I'd thought they would go up so much, I'd have bought TEN sets!:1948:

[Kragrifle]

I own both the original books and the copy sold on EBay. When Frank Mallory ran the operation it had the feel of a collector?s world with additions from subscribers and open discussion. As SRS is now dying it has been run as a money making proposition. The excellent website that I believe was constructed by John Spangler was quickly taken down, all books were taken off the market and you could only get information through the Cabin John address. So, thankfully someone did make copies of the information available, otherwise it will soon be lost unless someone can take over the operation and return it to the collector?s world.

[cessnapilot89]

Thank you all for the help!

[Johnny P]

Someone has posted a copy Charles Clawson's 3rd edition of his Collector's Guide to the internet. It is my understanding that a family lawyer is already lookng into this.