M1870 Trapdoor

[Merc]

A gun collector friend of mine texted me some photos a few months ago of a Springfield Trapdoor rifle that he bought for $400. I looked closely at the photos and compared them with my Model 1873 Springfield trapdoor and suspected that he just bought an earlier version of the Springfield trapdoor. I saw it in person yesterday and confirmed my suspicion. It is a Model 1870. That date is faintly stamped on the trapdoor near the hinge but “US” and “Model” that appear on the M1873 trapdoor are missing.

I noticed many differences between the M1870 and the M1873:

The overall length is longer than my M1873, the rear sight is different, the stock is different, “1863” is stamped on the left side of the lock plate indicating it was originally made for a musket, there is no serial number stamped in the usual place and there is no cartouche on the wrist. There are 2 hammer positions on the M1870 compared to 3 hammer positions on my M1873.

The rifle is currently in untouched condition with an abundance of surface rust on the barrel. I could not see any pitting. The rifling is good. Not as much surface rust seen on the hammer and trapdoor. I did not disassemble to look at other action components. The stock is in excellent condition. It has that dull dry look with no splits or cracks and minimal handling marks. The firing pin and spring were missing and the previous owner bought and installed replacements so it is shootable if he can find .50/70 ammo. The front sling/stacking swivels are missing and replacements should be available online. Everything else is there. I took several photos side by side with my M1873.

My friend wants to clean the rust from the barrel and oil the stock. I told him to wait until I get an expert opinion before doing anything that might possibly devalue his rifle.

So, what is this M1870 worth in its current condition? What should he do, if anything, to alter its current condition? Where can he buy .50/70 ammo?

5079850799508005080150802

[Lead Snowstorm]

Larger photos would be very beneficial. From what I believe I can see, it indeed appears to be an 1870 receiver. However, the marking you describe on the block is a bit confusing. The earliest M1870s indeed do not have "MODEL" and have "US" on the block; however, the later 1870s do have model, and the rear sight position is proper for the later 1870s, being a bit separated from the receiver:

https://i.imgur.com/PA5wb0C.jpg

https://i.imgur.com/Tc4H6bZ.jpg

I therefore conclude either the block is either an earlier M1870 block on a later 1870, and it is possible the block may have been changed; or, there is also the possibility that the block may actually be from an M1868. A picture of the underside of the block, well-demonstrating the arch, would conclusively resolve this issue.

https://i.imgur.com/RJYpKS6.jpg

Incidentally, the rear sight slider appears to be missing.

Looking at the first picture, again it is quite small but I can't see any cartouches and the stock flats are a little rounded, suggesting wear or sanding of the stock. For comparison:

https://i.imgur.com/W6qhqXb.jpg

Hopefully those more expert will chime in.

[Merc]

50803

Sorry, the corrosion hid the rest of the stamping. Only the word “Model” does not appear to be there.

I also see and agree that the stock probably was heavily sanded that evidently destroyed the cartouches.

I doubt that a replacement sight slider can be found.

[Dick Hosmer]

Only the 1000 "Allin-design" rifles and 300+ carbines (not yet THE Model 1870, although the deck was certainly stacked in their favor) made for the 1870 Trials had the rear sight tight to the new short receiver. Both production runs of the rifle had the sight set forward, and the carbine was never adopted. Most first-run M1870s have the single-shoulder rod and no "Model", and most second-run rifles have the double-shoulder rod, and ARE marked "Model". As to the sight slide, you should be able to turn one up as that sight was used on the 54,000 Model 1868s AND all of the nearly 45,000 rolling blocks, Spencers, and Ward-Burtons, etc. made at SA in that general time frame. So, around 100,000 of those sights, plus spare parts, were made. Don't give up!:1948:

[Merc]

Only the 1000 "Allin-design" rifles and 300+ carbines (not yet THE Model 1870, although the deck was certainly stacked in their favor) made for the 1870 Trials had the rear sight tight to the new short receiver. Both production runs of the rifle had the sight set forward, and the carbine was never adopted. Most first-run M1870s have the single-shoulder rod and no "Model", and most second-run rifles have the double-shoulder rod, and ARE marked "Model". As to the sight slide, you should be able to turn one up as that sight was used on the 54,000 Model 1868s AND all of the nearly 45,000 rolling blocks, Spencers, and Ward-Burtons, etc. made at SA in that general time frame. So, around 100,000 of those sights, plus spare parts, were made. Don't give up!:1948:

Where would be a good place to look for the slider?

[Dick Hosmer]

www.trapdoorcollector.com and any of the other parts suppliers listed there. Ebay. Gun shows. Just be patient. Several posters here probably have one in the junk/parts box.