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Art
12-13-2023, 11:47
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I50H9e3bGI0

An old, very old, older than the pilot MiG 29, with Soviet technology of the 1980s of the Ukrainian Air Force flying on the deck to evade Russian radar. The radar he is primarily interested in avoiding isn't ground based but on much more modern, or updated Russian fighters (MiG 31, Su 35 and Su 57) fighters armed with hypersonic Mach 5+) very long range air to air missiles capable of engaging at 150-200 miles. The Russian aircraft operate as a sort of aerial snipers, and have forced the Ukrainian aircraft to seek the shelter of ground clutter. By doing this they concede the advantages of altitude and position, what WWII pilots called "the bounce," to the Russians. If they are engaged they must immediately take violent evasive maneuvers and if they survive abort the mission to avoid follow up shots. Nobody has an equivalent to these Russian R 37 missiles. More modern fighters with the most advanced AAMRAM missiles would surely help but even the most advanced AAMRAMs which are just coming into production as a counter to the Russian missiles only have about half the reach of the Rooski weapons.

The Russians have a lot of problems. Their manpower is so depleted they are now recruiting from their clients in places like The Sudan :icon_e_surprised: . Yep I said The Sudan. They have been saved by their ability to construct very effective defenses in depth, the traditional stubborness of the Russian soldier in prepared defenses and, its a big and, their denial of air superiority over the battlefield to the Ukrainians, which is largely due to technological superiority in that area.

We sort of shrugged off these missiles, and for a while the Russians actually stopped producing them because of their very high cost. Needless to say the production line is up and running now. We are sure taking them seriously now.

Allen
12-13-2023, 12:30
Time to buy one of them via various sources and reverse engineer it.

dogtag
12-13-2023, 06:54
Biden is so intent on keeping our borders open, he's
willing to sacrifice Zelensky, Israel and Taiwan.
I'm all for sacrificing Zelensky. I'm for helping Israel.
and I can't see us facing off against China over Taiwan.
Ukraine and Taiwan need to make deals.

Major Tom
12-14-2023, 07:49
To HELL with Zewlinskyy. He's a multiple millionaire via our tax dollars.

Art
12-14-2023, 03:50
If I had intended a discussion of aid to Ukraine i would have posted this in the political section.

The major point is the Russians have developed long range air to air missile technology we don't have right now and won't for a while. We have new radars with the reach of the Russian ones but they are in the early stages of delivery. We have a new version of the AAMRAM with a 50% longer range but its still 50 - 100 miles short of the range of the longest range Russian weapons. We ignored this problem for years and are only now developing our own long range air to air missile.

Fortunately the Russians, being perpetually broke and inefficient when it comes to actual production of anything, only have something under 200 planes in their fleet capable of delivering these long range air to air missiles, and they don't have large stocks of the weapons themselves.

These weapons aren't perfect in the their current use. They were made to take down AWACS aircraft, tankers and such but the Russians have found their radars are sufficiently efficient and the missiles sufficiently accurate to be very useful in the role they're using them for now.

dogtag
12-14-2023, 05:49
Didn't mean to change the subject. My comment
had more to do with Biden's maniacal efforts to
keep the illegals pouring in to our country. It appears
to be his overriding passion. With probably in access
of ten million already here, how many more does he want ?
Will any number be enough ?