The Easter Proclamation

[Vern Humphrey]

Monday marks the 102nd anniversary of the Proclamation of Irish Independence:

POBLACHT NA hÉIREANN

THE PROVISIONAL GOVERNMENT OF THE IRISH REPUBLIC TO THE PEOPLE OF IRELAND

IRISHMEN AND IRISHWOMEN:
In the name of God and of the dead generations from which she receives her old tradition of nationhood, Ireland, through us, summons her children to her flag and strikes for her freedom.
Having organised and trained her manhood through her secret revolutionary organisation, the Irish Republican Brotherhood, and through her open military organisations, the Irish Volunteers and the Irish Citizen Army, having patiently perfected her discipline, having resolutely waited for the right moment to reveal itself, she now seizes that moment, and supported by her exiled children in America and by gallant allies in Europe, but relying in the first on her own strength, she strikes in full confidence of victory.

We declare the right of the people of Ireland to the ownership of Ireland and to the unfettered control of Irish destinies, to be sovereign and indefeasible. The long usurpation of that right by a foreign people and government has not extinguished the right, nor can it ever be extinguished except by the destruction of the Irish people. In every generation the Irish people have asserted their right to national freedom and sovereignty; six times during the past three hundred years they have asserted it in arms. Standing on that fundamental right and again asserting it in arms in the face of the world, we hereby proclaim the Irish Republic as a Sovereign Independent State, and we pledge our lives and the lives of our comrades in arms to the cause of its freedom, of its welfare, and of its exaltation among the nations.

[togor]

The Irish suffered brutally at the hands of the English. Consider the population disparities between England and Ireland. Yes the potato famine, which was made worse by cultivation practices forced upon them by the English.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irish_population_analysis

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demography_of_England

Kevin Phillips, in his book The Cousins Wars, pondered the question of whether or not England would have been able to establish the colonial presence in North America that they did without first subjugating the restive Irish that stood closer to home off of western shores of Britain.

I would regard it as poetic justice indeed if Dublin is able to gain some small advantage over London in the post-Brexit era. And the border between Ulster and the Republic, now a land frontier between the EU and Britain, will bear watching.

[bruce]

Have read just a bit about Ireland. Most of the history, most of the national story, sad and disappointing. From the perspective of 100 years, doubt that Ireland has ever really recovered from the Potato Famine. The population lost due to death by starvation, disease, the population lost by immigration, it is the sort of loss that no amount of money or raw materials can replace. At some point the final grasp of England will be pried free of Ireland. For better, or for worse, more likely for better, Ireland will exercise the national right of self-determination that is considered the norm of all free nations. England's brexit vote has pleased many of those who resented continental competition, etc. The cost to England are likely to be far more than anyone wants to pay. The EU is not going to accept a cheap play. England will have to pay up before it can walk out. Afterwards, England will have to compete on EU terms with no vote in how those terms are decided. It may very well be that Ireland will find itself in the drivers seat of talks that will decide the status of Ireland ... not merely as suits England but all of Ireland. England is not likely to waste money in a tight budget trying to hold on to land that has never been their's except at the point of a bayonet. JMHO. Sincerely. bruce.

[Vern Humphrey]

Let us hope the Irish are finally able to control their own destiny. May it come in my lifetime.

[clintonhater]

Let us hope the Irish are finally able to control their own destiny.

Not if they follow the lead of Britain in rolling out the red carpet to the scum of the Turd World...which they're already doing!

[TomSudz]

All I'm sayin' is that if the polacks ran out of potatoes, we'd have started killin' cows.

[free1954]

every year on st. Patrick's day I drink a toast to my irish ancestors who were smart enough to leave Ireland and come to America.

[snakehunter]

every year on st. Patrick's day I drink a toast to my irish ancestors who were smart enough to leave Ireland and come to America.

Da ya drink that toast with green whiskey or orange whiskey?

[Vern Humphrey]

All I'm sayin' is that if the polacks ran out of potatoes, we'd have started killin' cows.

They did -- and were stopped by the Army. The cattle were raised by the Ascendency, not by the peasantry. During An Ghorta Mor (The Great Hunger) port records show enough cattle and grain were shipped from Ireland to England to feed the population of Ireland.

[clintonhater]

Watched a terrific documentary on the revolt on PBS this afternoon: it was about as well-organized as your average Chinese fire-drill, with its leaders issuing contradictory orders. But it was not a sudden, spontaneous uprising--had been planned for months. Military reconnaissance, surveillance of British forces? Absolutely none!

British military command had been well aware of the formation of a large Irish para-military force--hundreds of them paraded in the street in their own uniforms, conducted drills, had acquired a significant quantity of smuggled arms, etc. Yet they took no repressive action (radically unlike Wilson's ruthless persecution of German-Americans!), because they did not believe Irish nationalists could organize any effective resistance! Like it or not, this uprising proved them right.

[Vern Humphrey]

Watched a terrific documentary on the revolt on PBS this afternoon: it was about as well-organized as your average Chinese fire-drill, with its leaders issuing contradictory orders. But it was not a sudden, spontaneous uprising--had been planned for months. Military reconnaissance, surveillance of British forces? Absolutely none!

British military command had been well aware of the formation of a large Irish para-military force--hundreds of them paraded in the street in their own uniforms, conducted drills, had acquired a significant quantity of smuggled arms, etc. Yet they took no repressive action (radically unlike Wilson's ruthless persecution of German-Americans!), because they did not believe Irish nationalists could organize any effective resistance! Like it or not, this uprising proved them right.

And wrong. The English snatched defeat from the jaws of victory -- their cruel, widespread repressive measures after the uprising collapsed brought on the "Tan War" (The Irish War of Independence) in 1920-21, and that WAS a spontaneous uprising, and a successful one.

[Sunray]

"...at the hands of the English..." It wasn't just the English. The Norman's in the 12th Century had a run at 'em too. So did the Norse before that.
Americans before, during and after your civil war discriminated against Irish immigrants too. Unless they joined your Army. Lot of the troopies that did the genocide of the natives were Irish.

[togor]

"...at the hands of the English..." It wasn't just the English. The Norman's in the 12th Century had a run at 'em too. So did the Norse before that.
Americans before, during and after your civil war discriminated against Irish immigrants too. Unless they joined your Army. Lot of the troopies that did the genocide of the natives were Irish.

Well the worst of the discrimination suffered in North America was at the hands of English descendants. The Norse were equal opportunity pillagers. I'll give you the Normans, whose descendants made the residents of the south of Britain the pr*cks that they largely are today. But it was the English Crown that ruthlessly extracted value from that island and its people. My blood on my mother's side is an amalgam from both islands, but my sympathies lie with the non-British part.

Making another Kevin Phillips reference, he regards Ulster as among the most brutal battlefields in the history of the Western Europe. It was no coincidence that the crown would recruit from there when buffer populations were needed near the frontier, along the lines of what you suggest.

[clintonhater]

I'll give you the Normans, whose descendants made the residents of the south of Britain the pr*cks that they largely are today.

The Normans conquered all Britain, including Scotland, in only a few yrs after their initial invasion. So it's rather strange that south Britons alone suffered this fate.

[togor]

The Normans conquered all Britain, including Scotland, in only a few yrs after their initial invasion. So it's rather strange that south Britons alone suffered this fate.

More Norman descendants closer to the channel.