Climate changes, people stay the same

[dryheat]

Boy, some climate change we've been having. Fires, hurricanes, hot weather. I've never seen anything like it. Wait, yes I have. Only now it 100 times worse than it used to be due to climate change. But if you want to build your pretty little house on a sand spit that's a whole 4' above sea level you don't get much sympathy from me.

[lyman]

ah,,

but if you rode a bike and stopped breeding those farting cattle, your house would be 4' and 1" above sea level,

[dryheat]

I think we're going to throw about 500 billion at that. I think we should launch the money into the sun it would appease the sun god. We have to think outside the box.

[togor]

I think we're going to throw about 500 billion at that. I think we should launch the money into the sun it would appease the sun god. We have to think outside the box.

Well the disasters may make taking action more palatable. If people's standard of living is already getting dented by calamity, outside the box thinking becomes a thing.

The smoke was unbelievably bad on one of the Minnesota trips this summer. But as luck would have it, in the high country (Wyoming) the winds took the smoke in a different direction. Incredible to see the stars with no light pollution.

[lyman]

except for when the smoke could have been prevented,

as in the fires started by humans, not nature,

or maybe even places like Cali allow some stuff to be done to lessen or prevent the fires all together

- - - Updated - - -

except for when the smoke could have been prevented,

as in the fires started by humans, not nature,

or maybe even places like Cali allow some stuff to be done to lessen or prevent the fires all together

[togor]

Well they could preventively cut down all the trees in North America anywhere there's dry lightning or camp fires if that's what you mean by "some stuff".

But then we'd be reading about huge mudslides after the torrential rains that are also more frequent now.

Huge changes all over the globe now. It's impossible to miss unless people are locked into denial, which some clearly are.

[Major Tom]

Lying Biden isn't worried about air pollution! Example, when he flew from D.C. to the airport where the 13 troops killed in Afganistan were unloaded; he flew in a big jet to get there! A whole 95 mile trip! Peolsi flys cross country to get her hair done and later to have a big fund raiser for ikabod!

[lyman]

Well they could preventively cut down all the trees in North America anywhere there's dry lightning or camp fires if that's what you mean by "some stuff".

But then we'd be reading about huge mudslides after the torrential rains that are also more frequent now.

Huge changes all over the globe now. It's impossible to miss unless people are locked into denial, which some clearly are.

look into the Cali issues a bit deeper, and you will find they have many restrictions on fire breaks, clearing power lines, etc etc, that would minimize or prevent the yuge fires,


and of course, we humans, or at least a few, are a bit too stupid and set them accidently, or in a lot of cases, deliberately

[togor]

look into the Cali issues a bit deeper, and you will find they have many restrictions on fire breaks, clearing power lines, etc etc, that would minimize or prevent the yuge fires,


and of course, we humans, or at least a few, are a bit too stupid and set them accidently, or in a lot of cases, deliberately

We once discussed this subject at length, and I asked you if there was any development you could think of that would lead you to believe that climate change is real. You replied that no, there wasn't.

Still the case, right?

Given that it is a matter of belief for you, not something needing ongoing examination on the basis of facts and evidence, your line of argument will always be to ignore the facts you don't like and use the ones you do to push your beliefs.

It's true that more extensive brush clearing would reduce fires. But that was also true in the 1960's, '70, 80's, 90's, 00's, and 10's. Agreed? What's different now are the climatic conditions, that difficult fires more likely. And the trend lines are pointing in the wrong direction.

[lyman]

We once discussed this subject at length, and I asked you if there was any development you could think of that would lead you to believe that climate change is real. You replied that no, there wasn't.

Still the case, right?

Given that it is a matter of belief for you, not something needing ongoing examination on the basis of facts and evidence, your line of argument will always be to ignore the facts you don't like and use the ones you do to push your beliefs.

It's true that more extensive brush clearing would reduce fires. But that was also true in the 1960's, '70, 80's, 90's, 00's, and 10's. Agreed? What's different now are the climatic conditions, that difficult fires more likely. And the trend lines are pointing in the wrong direction.

that horse is getting higher and higher,,


in the 60's 70's 80' did we have the same number of fires or the same (numbers adjusted for inflation etc) number of lost home value?

did Cali enact those restrictions in the past 5? 10? or more years ago?


so , if a 1000 acres burnt up and out in 1960,, vs those same 1000 today, what is the property damage, and could it have been prevented or stopped earlier, or did Cali prohibit any preventive measures and allow homes to be built in areas with potential repeat hazards,


have lightning strikes increased?

has the Cali Electric folks maintained the power lines and done preventative maintenance, and been allowed to clear the area the lines cross?



way way to many variables and the climate changes every day,

[Art]

I'll worry more when some predictions start to happen on time.

In 1988 articles were published saying the Maldives would be under water in thirty years. Here we are 33 years later and the Maldives are still pretty much as the were in 1988.

Jimmy carter once said, while he was president that the world's supply of fossil fuel would be used up by 2011. That obviously hasn't happened. That scenario would have suited the current crop of enviro-nuts very well though.

Remember the old Charlton Heston Sci Fi flick "Soylent Green?" That was a seriously cautionary tale in the early 1970s based on the best environmental science at the time (especially the work of Paul Ehrlich) of what the world would be like now, I mean right now. It was made with the American Association of Environmental Engineers as the technical staff. Well, they sure got their predictions seriously wrong. Heston was an activists on several fronts including the environment and was wholeheartedly behind the premises (based on the "best" info at the time) of the film.

Ocasio Cortez says if we don't do what she thinks is best we're screwed by 2030. I expect in 2030 we'll be hearing the same thing about 2050 or 2060.

The world is a bit warmer than it was. Is this a natural cycle or man made activity? Well the man made activity crowd's track record hasn't impressed me yet. I was listening several years ago to climatologist speaking on the subject. When asked about the current warming trend she said she believed the current conditions are a natural swing from a much colder period that started in the late middle ages. She was pressed saying that 95% of climate scientists disagree with her. She surprised the interviewer by saying that she was actually part of the 95% because she believed that human activity has some effect on everything that happens on the planet including the temperature and that the 95% includes anyone in her discipline that believes human activity has any effect on the climate no matter how trivial. She just does not believe human activity is the primary cause.

The idea that human beings can keep the earth in some sort of climate stasis smacks of serious hubris.

[Allen]

Have you ever wondered why the Egyptians lived like they did and built all those pyramids in such a barren desert?

I watched an episode on the History Channel I believe that spoke on what killed off the Egyptians. The food packed with their mummy's, the artwork on the walls inside the tombs and the written manuscrpts all indicate they once lived in a different setting.

The artwork shows animals, grassy plains, scrubs, trees and hunters. The mummy's appeared to be healty at the time of death and they built items out of wood. Their area was depicted as looking a lot like Africa.

Then the great "global warming" came and dried up eveything. This was 4000 years ago.

Must have been caused by all those farting camels and predictions by the Al Gorian's.

[togor]

https://mobile.twitter.com/hashtag/Chanthu?src=hashtag_click

Meanwhile in the Western Pacific, a tropical depression turned into a cat 5 super typhoon in just over 48 hours.

That has happened only 5 times in the past in the records:

2002
2017
2018
2019
2020

More pronounced, rapid intensification of storms is one of the predictions of climate scientists.

And no, it's not just everything being a tad warmer everywhere uniformly, if that's what people are assuming. Climate is a dynamic system, and the effects of CO2/methane absorption are not uniformly distributed across the globe.

What we are seeing now is major changes in how energy flows in the atmosphere and oceans.

And the rider on the high horse is the one insisting that there's nothing anyone can say or show him that will get him to change his mind.

[Allen]

What BS.

I've lived on the Gulf Coast all my life and have witnessed many strong hurricanes. Many more than you mention. Every year we have them. Most all of them lose some strength shortly before hitting land.

[lyman]

https://mobile.twitter.com/hashtag/C...=hashtag_click


Meanwhile in the Western Pacific, a tropical depression turned into a cat 5 super typhoon in just over 48 hours.

That has happened only 5 times in the past in the records:

2002
2017
2018
2019
2020

More pronounced, rapid intensification of storms is one of the predictions of climate scientists.

And no, it's not just everything being a tad warmer everywhere uniformly, if that's what people are assuming. Climate is a dynamic system, and the effects of CO2/methane absorption are not uniformly distributed across the globe.

What we are seeing now is major changes in how energy flows in the atmosphere and oceans.

And the rider on the high horse is the one insisting that there's nothing anyone can say or show him that will get him to change his mind.

here you go, incase you wanna see it,

https://earth.nullschool.net/#current/wind/surface/level/orthographic=-89.33,30.19,1092/loc=-77.278,37.382

meanwhile , how far back to those records go?