4th block M-1899 carbine.

[5MadFarmers]

Aha, the red flag has been waved - will the bull charge? Getcher popcorn right here, folks!

Looking forward to an informative and spirited discussion.

No, a blanket was draped over a fire producing smoke. First it was his guns. Now it's "observed guns from a reliable source." What next? Rumored to have been seen in Botswana by Stanley and Livingston? What happened to his guns? We know don't we? Let me speculate on this.

Magazine Rifles. Without understanding those much was misty. I will in point of fact claim to be the first one to fully understand that and the implications. Cadets were cracked. I've now cracked the "M-1896 rifles manufactured in FY95-96" but haven't detailed that. Perhaps we should let Kragrifle have a go at it. Logic cracks that puzzle - nothing more is needed.

Understanding that parts were made after the fact for earlier models clears up much and invalidates much of what was accepted.

Shall we continue? Want more?

Tom I do respect. Very much so. If he, and I'd say that is the logical suspect, observed those numbers with that marking one needs to take note. If he claimed to have observed them I'd very much believe him. The problem is what they were. Tom didn't understand the M-1896 lugged rifle sights for what they are and grossly overestimated the numbers via that misunderstanding. I don't think anyone, before I just mentioned it, understood that guns were stamped both before and after receiver hardening. Which completely changes that picture. One overstamped before hardening is not obvious. It must be looked at very closely. So the question is, if those numbers were observed, are they clean 1899s? 1899s made from 1898s? Made before or after the fact?

I do get Tom wouldn't have a detailed picture if he did see them. That's modern technology. So, in that event, it'll remain unresolved until one appears. Detailed examination may be made. Conversely if one of the claimed guns is in known hands detailed digital photos can be made of that model marking. If it's a clean 1899 we have a mystery.

Right now what we have is "my guns" turned into "claimed by somebody else."

[Kragrifle]

Since you invoked his name, yes, Tom Pearce is the reliable source. It's too bad some people have over reacted to a discussion about Krags. It's also unfortunate when these people try to impress us with all their "knowledge " in such a condescending fashion. Try to make your statement, present your data and reach your conclusion in something less than 10,000 words and without mocking the intelligence of your would be readers. Such braggadocio is the hobgoblin of little minds.

[Mark Daiute]

Since you invoked his name, yes, Tom Pearce is the reliable source. It's too bad some people have over reacted to a discussion about Krags. It's also unfortunate when these people try to impress us with all their "knowledge " in such a condescending fashion. Try to make your statement, present your data and reach your conclusion in something less than 10,000 words and without mocking the intelligence of your would be readers. Such braggadocio is the hobgoblin of little minds.

I have a different assessment of Joe's comments. After reading and watching for quite a few years my view is that he makes blunt statements of fact devoid of condescension or braggadocio or any other regard for any emotion of any kind. He simply makes statements he knows to be fact based on his work. I can see where this could be misconstrued as condescension.

[Dick Hosmer]

You know, the substance is one thing, the delivery is another. One old friend can come up, slap you on the back and say "How the hell are you, you old SOB, haven't seen you in 20 years" and NO offense is taken. Or, someone can sneer through pursed lips "you f'n SOB" and a totally different response is warranted. Life is a sliding scale - we don't all see things the same way, but to dismiss the feelings of a longtime, serious, and gentlemanly collector is IMHO, not right.

[jon_norstog]

Peace, guys! I like 5MF (AKA Mr. Farmer) ... he reminds me of Thelonius Monk. he's a savant, someone you got to treasure even if you are puzzled by the way he expresses himself. Whatever he says, he's probably right, 'cause he did the research and dug into the primary source documents.

I ain't Emily Post and I will not lecture someone on their ettiquit especially given that mine needs a tune-up. We are all in this together and I would say we are having a pretty decent time of it.

I WILL make it to Camp Perry some summer.

jn