Garand ammo

[JOHN COOK]

I was reading on another site where the question came up about 30:06 ammo. The post was in 2007. I don?t own and never shot a GARAND. A statement was made that you shouldn?t or couldn?t use ammo that was designed for the 1903 Springfield in a GARAND. Person also stated 30:06 ammo was specially made for the GARAND due to fact 1903 rifle ammo was to hot and would damage ?gas?valve in GARAND. If I recall correctly both of these weapons were used in WW II at the same time and I assume they used the same M 2 ball round. Sounded to me like a bunch of BS. Person also stated you shouldn?t use commercial 30:06 ammo due to the same reason, it would damage the rifle. Appreciate comments concerning this persons post..

Thanks,
John in SC

[Art]

This is not correct. The M1 rifle, as a final product, was designed to use the ammunition available when it was designed and introduced in the 1930s. This was the same ammunition designed for and used in the M1903 weapon. In fact, the use of ammunition the M1 was originally to use, a .276 cal cartridge, was dropped because of the very large amount of .30 cal. ammunition for the M1903 rifle that was on hand and the fact that the military would either have had to redesign its automatic weapons to use the new cartridge or live with the logistical nightmare of a .276 caliber rifle and .30 caliber everything else.

Shooting modern high velocity ammunition in an M1 is supposed to be somewhat problematic long term but any problem with this can be fixed by using an adjustable gas cylinder plug. I personally would err on the side of caution and use either GI ammunition, its commercial equivalent marked "For M1 Rifle," or handloads designated in the manuals specifically for the M1 rifle. Current reloading manuals have sections specifically for loads taylored to the M1.

[J.J.]

This is a direct quote from "Hatcher's Notebook":
"In trying to determine the ultimate strength of the gun, Mr. Garand built up progressively higher proof loads in increments of 5000 lbs pressure , from the regular proof load of 70,000 lbs to the extreme figure of 120,000 lbs, per square inch.
At this latter figure, cracked left lugs on the bolt began to be encountered. A gun in which the bolt had the left lug cracked by one of these successive high pressure overloads was then fired an endurance test of 5000 rounds of service ammunition, using the cracked bolt which showed no further deterioration. The US M1 Rifle thus has perhaps the strongest action of any military shoulder rifle in existence at this time (1947).
The key to loads in the M1 is port pressure, not breech pressure. As long as loads in the burning rate of IMR4895 or IMR 4064 are used no adjustable gas plug is necessary. When powders such as IMR 4350 are used then an adjustable gas plug must be used.
Of course if handloading for the rifle no loads exceeding the listed maximum should ever be used just as in loading for any other rifle.
J.J.
J.J.

[lyman]

Art and JJ nailed it

[JOHN COOK]

Thanks guys. As I stated I was not familiar with the GARAND and it’s operation. I appreciate the information it was direct and to the point..

John in SC

[Johnny P]

Don't have any knowledge of problems, but it has often been cautioned about firing commercial ammunition in the M1 Rifle. Not that the rifle action itself is not strong enough, but that a different pressure curve can bend the long and already crooked op-rod. The gas system was balanced for a specific burn rate and pressure.

[barretcreek]

Garandgear.com has a section on pressure curves for different commercial ammo. As well as other stuff.

[fguffey]

The chamber for the M1 Garand was different as in 'it was not the same chamber as the 03, M1917.

F. Guffey

[togor]

The combination of a heavy bullet and slow powder, perfectly fine for a bolt gun, give the high port pressure in the Garand. Pretty much what everyone already knows, that once you get north of 175 grains in bullet weight, it gets trickier to keep both ends of a Garand barrel happy, without resorting to some help.

As for chambers, I use the same reamer (Manson) for '03 and M1 barrels and nobody has ever suggested that's a boo boo.

[k arga]

F. Guffey, could you please explain to me what the difference in the chambers of the 03, 1917 and the garand is ?
thanks kurt

[lyman]

As for chambers, I use the same reamer (Manson) for '03 and M1 barrels and nobody has ever suggested that's a boo boo.

and I have barreled and rebarreled lots of M1's and 1903/1903A3 using the same reamer, (well actually, 2 reamers, the first one was dropped and chipped, so we bought another,,) since the 80's w/o issues,
even use the same headspace gauges that Uncle Sam used,,, in all 3

[fguffey]

F. Guffey, could you please explain to me what the difference in the chambers of the 03, 1917 and the Garand is ?
thanks kurt

Arga, "please explain to me": Yes sir but I want you to notice the consciences is there is no way the ones that nailed it can be wrong. The M1 Had two chambers. To avoid the gnashing of teeth I will send you an email.

F. Guffey

[togor]

The combination of a heavy bullet and slow powder, perfectly fine for a bolt gun, give the high port pressure in the Garand. Pretty much what everyone already knows, that once you get north of 175 grains in bullet weight, it gets trickier to keep both ends of a Garand barrel happy, without resorting to some help.

- - - Updated - - -

Arga, "please explain to me": Yes sir but I want you to notice the consciences is there is no way the ones that nailed it can be wrong. The M1 Had two chambers. To avoid the gnashing of teeth I will send you an email.

F. Guffey

Why over-complicate the subject?

[lyman]

The combination of a heavy bullet and slow powder, perfectly fine for a bolt gun, give the high port pressure in the Garand. Pretty much what everyone already knows, that once you get north of 175 grains in bullet weight, it gets trickier to keep both ends of a Garand barrel happy, without resorting to some help.

- - - Updated - - -



Why over-complicate the subject?

fixed your original post and edited mine, for future reading, don't want to confuse anyone,

[togor]

fixed your original post and edited mine, for future reading, don't want to confuse anyone,

Yes agree don't want to cause an unintended mistake. Thanks to the CMP newcomers are still getting into Garands. Good to see!