What to fire in a LN receiver

[swampyankee]

As the saying goes "a little knowledge is a dangerous thing". I was going along happily for 30 years shooting my beloved 1903's until I was enlightened with the knowledge that my treasured guns could blow up in my face. I still shoot them but I'm no longer comfortable doing it, So the question, what can I shoot in it? I do not want to convert with a .22 sleave. I have heard some guys are using a pistol caliber insert or just shoot lead or load way down. There has to be something? Any suggestions?

[13Echo]

If the rifle hasn't blown up after a hundred years service it isn't likely too with standard loads. Many of them served through WWi and again in WWII and if a Marine or GI couldn't break them they are likely actually safe. Michael Petrov had several that had been redone by the great smiths of the 20s and 30s and he had no qualms about full power loads, but, again, never tried to hot rod the rifles. That said many, probably most, of the Low Number receivers are very brittle and prudence would dictate treating them gingerly. I use mine with cast bullets only and I don't hot rod. The High Number double heat treated and nickle steel actions are safe with any reasonable load.

Jerry Liles

[dave]

Most that did blow were because of other reasons, according to Hatcher. Most people seem to mock Hatcher but I think he knew what he was about!

[swampyankee]

In one of the gun rags I was reading Mike Venturino was shooting 30-06 training ammo, I've never seen it, has anybody else. It appears to be safe.
As I said I still shoot mine but now I have that little voice in my head telling me not too. I hate the internet, ignorance is bliss.

[chuckindenver]

this one 700,k serial failed 2 days ago. with a published hand load. cast bullet..
keep shootin..

[swampyankee]

How did it fail? Ruptured case, double charge or just pulling trigger on normal load?

[gnoahhh]

Published cast bullet load? Who published it? Do we know for a fact that the case didn't hold a double or triple charge of powder? (Hard to tell once the powder has been burned, no?) Was the bullet from the previous shot lodged in the barrel? Are there witnesses who can vouch for the QC during the whole process from the loading bench to the firing line? A pic of a wrecked LN receiver is truly disturbing, but until I'm satisfied as to the provenance of the circumstances that caused it, I'll withhold judgement on this one.

IMO the LN rifles have a pretty low margin of error and an egregious act (shooter error) that wouldn't unduly strain a more modern action could indeed rupture it.

Just as in incidents of crazy people going on killing sprees, are we going to rush to judgement and blame the gun and not the shooter?

[13Echo]

Need a better picture, a picture of the case and the bolt and what load was supposed to have been used.

[chuckindenver]

have plenty of SHT failures, that have happened in the last 5 years... dont sugar coat the deal...
dont care if you shoot them.
just know the facts and dangers..

SHt 1903s dont survive a simple common case head failure.

[chuckindenver]

another..

[chuckindenver]

from the owner of said rifle,,

It was a 14 grains of unique with a 311284 bullet cast with lyman #2 alloy and gas checked

[PhillipM]

Published cast bullet load? Who published it? Do we know for a fact that the case didn't hold a double or triple charge of powder? (Hard to tell once the powder has been burned, no?) Was the bullet from the previous shot lodged in the barrel? Are there witnesses who can vouch for the QC during the whole process from the loading bench to the firing line? A pic of a wrecked LN receiver is truly disturbing, but until I'm satisfied as to the provenance of the circumstances that caused it, I'll withhold judgement on this one.

IMO the LN rifles have a pretty low margin of error and an egregious act (shooter error) that wouldn't unduly strain a more modern action could indeed rupture it.

Just as in incidents of crazy people going on killing sprees, are we going to rush to judgement and blame the gun and not the shooter?

I think he double charged it, some say it was the semi-mythical detonation where the powder goes off like a bomb, the case head ruptured and had to hammer it out, but of course he denied it could possibly be his reloads. Then he mentioned in another comment it was strange because he had been shooting 35 regular power loads just before with no problems.

If you elect to shoot a low number, my advise is to use standard milsurp ball or standard loads with slow burning powder like 4895, 4350, and 4831 and stay far away from pistol powders like Unique. If you double charge with pistol powder, you blow up, if you double charge with rifle powder, you have a mess.

I don't shoot mine, but I wouldn't be scared to, because I have high numbers just like the low numbers that shoot great.

[13Echo]

Good advice from Phillip.

The rifle in question certainly had one of the brittle receivers however it had nicely survived regular full power loads only to succumb to a low power cast bullet load. I'd bet sugar cookies that it was a double charge. I'd really like to see the bolt and case.

A double charge of pistol powder is a rifle wrecker. A savage 110, a strong action, let go at the local range last weekend for the same reason. That said the LN '03 is known to have problems. I shoot mine.

Jerry Liles

[PhillipM]

Good advice from Phillip.

The rifle in question certainly had one of the brittle receivers however it had nicely survived regular full power loads only to succumb to a low power cast bullet load. I'd bet sugar cookies that it was a double charge. I'd really like to see the bolt and case.

A double charge of pistol powder is a rifle wrecker. A savage 110, a strong action, let go at the local range last weekend for the same reason. That said the LN '03 is known to have problems. I shoot mine.

Jerry Liles

He didn't show the bolt. Caption, "13 grains of unique 200 grain lead bullet cci 200 primers. This is the case I beat out of the chamber"

Other comments he made: "The bolt looks to be undamaged. Took a block and a hammer to get pOpen and a1/4 steelrod to get the case out"

"My son is a safe reloaded and has not had any problems with the many hundreds he has loaded"

"The sad part or good part he had just fired 35 full power loads"

"It was a 14 grains of unique with a 311284 bullet cast with lyman #2 alloy and gas checked"

https://www.facebook.com/groups/1903loverscollectors/

[StockDoc]

from the owner of said rifle,,

It was a 14 grains of unique with a 311284 bullet cast with lyman #2 alloy and gas checked

save your fingers Chuck, you will not convince them. Let them add ammo to "Gun Grabbers" that guns are dangerous. "Rifle blows up killing/injuring shooter, guns are unsafe"