"E" on receiver ring?......

[M1Tommy]

First, this isn't my rifle. And, the photo is not pretty, at all, IMO!
I've offered to give it a once-over and "help him clean it up a bit".

Someone near me asked about this rifle. Apparently it was from an older family member.
Anyways, what is the "E" on the receiver ring? If this is an M1917-101 level question, y'all please humor me and use little words!

[M1Tommy]

It's the handguard retainer ring, Eddystone part.
"duh" on me........... I know...

Tommy

[Dan Shapiro]

As I tell ROTC units when I give an antique weapons presentation:

There's no such thing as a 'dumb' question.
1) It means you're paying attention.
2) I'm not boring you.
3) It shows that you're interested and want more information.

[M1Tommy]

More importantly, I cannot tell from the guy's photo if that's a scratch, a hair or a crack between the lines with U.S. and MODEL OF 1917.
I'm no M1917 guru, my one having been foolishly horse traded away years ago, but I'd think that a crack induced by re-barreling would not come from that direction.

Apparently other family member have "told him that grandpa never would shoot it again...."

Thanks for that reply.
Tommy

[RC20]

I see not directly answered. We all learn and I have had my share of mistakes. Better to ask first as you did.

Please be careful on cleanup as to to alter things. Stock should be done gently with soapy water and not finish work as you can alter that past the value (look at the tip and see what mfg mark is on it)

Short answer and history is that the Model of 1917 aka Eddystone or " Enfield was made by 3 mfgs.

Remington in Ilion NY, A Remington subsidiary and then independent operation called Eddystone in PY and Winchester (New Haven?)

The parts ultimately were interchangeable though many were so early and likely non critical ones were the easiest (most tolerance).

If you disassemble the gun and or look at details you can see on the surface (sights, bolt, safety etc) you likely will fine a wide variety of R, E as well as W marked parts as well as a few others. These tended to be re-arsenaled and parts got replaced with whatever was at hand as they no longer cared (all original parts 1917s are not common but out there)

The Bolt will have a stamp on it of R, W, or E, you may be able to see the same on the cocking piece.

Some only have numbers but those number can be traced to specific mfg (inspector numbers used exclusively at the plants)

My Winchester has an unmarked mfg front sight blade but does have the 400 number on it which makes it a Winchester factory part.

CS Ferris has a very good book at a low price on the gun if you want to read up on the markings and variations.

None of mine are all OEM parts, they all saw service of some sort and replacement parts added or reused and they all came out of common bins most likely as it did not matter.

On the other hand, there is no known cross of parts in the OEM mfg process, whether that was a government thing and they all had to be single accountable to the OEM that built the rifle or they simply did not exchange parts if anyone had excess is unknown to the best of my knowledge (or speculative). It did not happen as far as anyone ahs ever documented.

[DRAGONFLYDF]

take it to a machine shop that does dye penetrate or eddy current inspections and see if they would test it for you

[RC20]

Why?

[M1Tommy]

I see not directly answered. We all learn and I have had my share of mistakes. Better to ask first as you did.

Please be careful on cleanup as to to alter things. Stock should be done gently.................


......On the other hand, there is no known cross of parts in the OEM mfg process, whether that was a government thing and they all had to be single accountable to the OEM that built the rifle or they simply did not exchange parts if anyone had excess is unknown to the best of my knowledge (or speculative). It did not happen as far as anyone ahs ever documented.

Understand. I have owned several older rifles before, have made my share of mistakes, and have cleaned and 'refreshed' some old stocks that now are 'much healthier' too.

take it to a machine shop that does dye penetrate or eddy current inspections and see if they would test it for you

If he allows me to look it over, I will at very least do a "gasoline test" on the receiver.... and will advise what you said if there is ANY doubt at all.

Thanks for the replies.
Tommy

[Dan Shapiro]

Why?

It will determine if its' a 'scratch' or an actual 'break' in the metal.

[oldtirediron]

Check It??

I am not sure what the problem is here but 1917 Enfields were known for their inherinet over torqued barrel especially Eddystone and Winchester rifles ! I know because removing the barrel from many sporterized receiver's and it entailed a 6 foot extension bar and standing on the end of it to loosen the barrel ! Seems others had this problem also and usually they cut the barrel in a lathe to remove the barrel from the receiver about 1/16 from the receiver face. Not to be defeated by an M1917 Enfield I would put a barrel wrench on the receiver and rosin on the receiver and screw it together in a Brownell's barrel vice and receiver wrench After jumping up and down on the barrel wrench extension that was made from a car axel it would finally give after a few hops of my 230 Lb frame on the end os the 5 foot barrel wrench extension ! A loud crack and the barrel would be free but the Enfield 1917 was the worst offender of all US Military arms !the barrels were torqued on supposedly to 120 lb foot statistics more than double what they should have been- The builders at the Baldwin Locomotive works (Eddystone)were even worse and those barrels aree sometimes immovable except by lathe action !!

[M1Tommy]

Sir, Yes, I've heard similar from others.
I am about to cobble together my first AR-15, and trust that similar antics won't be warranted, eh?!? <grin>
Thanks for that reply.
Tommy

[RC20]

It will determine if its' a 'scratch' or an actual 'break' in the metal.

My apologies, I missed the post on the crack, I think it came through while I was formulating my reply. Regardless I did miss it.

I see both the suspected crack /scratch and the post and yes it should be checked out.

It does seem an odd place for a crack as my understanding is that they occurred in the thread area, no experience with that other than general work related and defer to others with that specific experience.

[RC20]

M1Tommy: If you can get the date off (and MFG) the barrel we can cross reference the serial to build date to see if there indeed was a likely barrel replacement.

I don't know that end of the history well (barrel replacement), I have yet to see one that got even a different mfg barrel that was not a civilian change or WWII era, but again limited experience in that regard.

I have seen a number of the 1903s that was done on. You would think spare barrels made and it should show up on the 1917s - interesting area.

If barrel were too tight then it would have to do with the mfg process and not a torque spec. I.e. the barrels are lined up to a witness mark, you meet the mark. If more torque used to get there than there should have been then something in the barrel machining or the receivers would have been out of spec. Same end result to break loose of course and as they cranked out many thousands a day as long as they lined up it might have been expedient to continue.

somewhere in that though the inspectors should have caught on as tolerances would have been off and should be caught on master gauges.

I continue to ponder the spare barrel situation as the 1903s were supplied with spare parts for so many made (at least WWII) but I have yet to see similar for the 1917s in the barrel arena.

[M1Tommy]

My apologies, I missed the post on the crack, I think it came through while I was formulating my reply. Regardless I did miss it.

I see both the suspected crack /scratch and the post and yes it should be checked out.

It does seem an odd place for a crack as my understanding is that they occurred in the thread area, no experience with that other than general work related and defer to others with that specific experience.

Understood and agree. Thanks, Tommy

[M1Tommy]

M1Tommy: If you can get the date off (and MFG) the barrel we can cross reference the serial to build date to see if there indeed was a likely barrel replacement. .............

Understood. I'm not sure just when I may get to look at that rifle. It is about 120 miles from me, I just learned.
RE M1917 replacement barrels, I agree. I've never come across a "new old stock" M1917 barrel myself.

Tommy