April 19, 1943....

[blackhawknj]

....RKBA Day in my book. The Nazis decide to raze the Warsaw Ghetto, the inhabitants fought back as best they could, with what they had- 1 rifle for every twenty men or so. Interesting to think how it would have gone if every male of fighting age had a Mauser 98k with 100 rounds.
"How long would the Nazis have kept it up, General, if every Jew they came after had met them with a gun in his hand?"
Professor Groetschele (Walter Matthau) in Fail Safe. (1964)

[Vern Humphrey]

I had a liberal once tell me, "Don't be silly. If the Jews had resisted the Nazis, they would all have been killed."

I replied, "So it's your theory that by not resisting they all survived?"

[bruce]

The Russians sat back and let it all happen. Sincerely. bruce.

[togor]

German Jews were less than 1% of the prewar population. A fact that you can read at the Holocaust Museum in Washington, D.C.

[blackhawknj]

The Soviets-Stalin-refused to assist the Warsaw Uprising of August, 1944.
"Stay alive-don't resist!" Where have we heard THAT before ?

[TomSudz]

German Jews were less than 1% of the prewar population. A fact that you can read at the Holocaust Museum in Washington, D.C.

Warsaw is in POLAND, a fact that's probably also in the museum.

[free1954]

MILA 18 by leon uris is a very good read about that struggle. and yes, think of what they could have done if they weren't just armed with homemade and obsolete weapons. the jews learned a valuable there. a lesson i'm sure they teach in Israeli schools

[bruce]

Re: Lesson. It was what it was. Even if every man, woman and child had been armed, it would not have mattered. Disorganized people w/ small arms are not going to accomplish much against well-organized, experienced combat soldiers w/ access to a plethora of weapons. The Jews of Warsaw were going to die no matter what. The only thing that could have stopped it is if the russians had moved against the Germans. That of course was never going to happen. Ole stalin had no interest in seeing problematic Polish Jews survive. At least the ones who had weapons were able to do something to defend themselves. Nevertheless, a picked up KAR-98 or even a MG-42 wouldn't matter going up against 88's. No different than when the british put down the Easter Uprising in Ireland. They just brought in combat soldiers and heavy weapons. It was soon over. No difference. JMHO. Sincerely. bruce.

[togor]

Warsaw is in POLAND, a fact that's probably also in the museum.

No sh*t, but the premise is that if Jews in the Reich would have been armed, they could have prevented their fate. Against SA thugs in the 30's, before the Nazis consolidate power? Big maybe. In Poland against the German Military? Not a chance.

No way do the Jews have the numbers to survive an extended cultural assault (civil or military) in central or eastern Europe. The only viable RKBA argument you could make is that armed Jews in the west could temporarily protect themselves against the depredations of illiberal regimes, holding the line until traditional western values of tolerance and liberalism were restored. But somehow I don't think that is the point the OP intended to make!

[S.A. Boggs]

Re: Lesson. It was what it was. Even if every man, woman and child had been armed, it would not have mattered. Disorganized people w/ small arms are not going to accomplish much against well-organized, experienced combat soldiers w/ access to a plethora of weapons. The Jews of Warsaw were going to die no matter what. The only thing that could have stopped it is if the russians had moved against the Germans. That of course was never going to happen. Ole stalin had no interest in seeing problematic Polish Jews survive. At least the ones who had weapons were able to do something to defend themselves. Nevertheless, a picked up KAR-98 or even a MG-42 wouldn't matter going up against 88's. No different than when the british put down the Easter Uprising in Ireland. They just brought in combat soldiers and heavy weapons. It was soon over. No difference. JMHO. Sincerely. bruce.

The freedom of Ireland started with the Easter Uprising, hopefully the rest of my ancestral homeland will be freed. "It is better to die on one's feet then to live on one's knees." The Jewish Uprising does have a significant affect on the thinking of present day Israel and their ready nature.
Sam

[Vern Humphrey]

The freedom of Ireland started with the Easter Uprising, hopefully the rest of my ancestral homeland will be freed. "It is better to die on one's feet then to live on one's knees." The Jewish Uprising does have a significant affect on the thinking of present day Israel and their ready nature.
Sam

And we Irish were just as disorganized and poorly armed when we began. In 1798, Thomas Clooney, a relative of mine, won the battle of the Three Rocks. The Irish didn't have guns -- they charged the English with home made pikes -- and routed them.

Up with the Green Flag!

[Sandpebble]

And we Irish were just as disorganized and poorly armed when we began. In 1798, Thomas Clooney, a relative of mine, won the battle of the Three Rocks. The Irish didn't have guns -- they charged the English with home made pikes -- and routed them.

Up with the Green Flag!

" We Irish " you say....

" Up with the green flag " you say.....

You an American or not.... ?

[S.A. Boggs]

" We Irish " you say....

" Up with the green flag " you say.....

You an American or not.... ?

More American it appears then you.
Sam

[blackhawknj]

The assault on the Warsaw Ghetto was carried out by police units, they were not know for their valor.
The British actions that led to Lexington and Concord were carried out by one of the most professional armies against farmers, townsmen and tradesman and.....what was it the one British officer said after Bunker Hill?
"Damn the rebels that they would not flinch!"

[JB White]

Those rebels were equally armed, well fed, and had room to maneuver into position. They weren't starving prisoners locked into a ghetto with just a few weapons at their disposal.