Gee.. who to believe ... ?

[Sandpebble]

Seems that on one side we have American intelligence agencies with men and women who have devoted a lifetime of service to the defense of this nation ...

On the other side is an ex Russian KGB phsychological war expert .......

My attitude might not be the same as yours..... but as an American...... I know who I think we should believe

[Vern Humphrey]

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.

[togor]

Believe this guy or that guy? Really that's smoke and mirrors. What's not smoke and mirrors is this--

Trump has an America First policy, which he is not shy about parading in press conferences with a host of other world leaders. And yet what is the Russian complaint about the US from the collapse of the Soviet Union, through two Bushes, a Clinton and an Obama? That the US practiced...you guessed it...a naked America First policy! So it's America first except when it's Russia, then it's America second, Russia first! Mueller handed Trump leverage to use at the meeting, the press conference, with the indictments. What did Trump, President Leverage, do with it? Piss on it. That, fellow jousters, is what Kompromat looks like. Trump is Trump, except where Putin and the Russians are concerned. They've got him. We may never know the details of how, but by God thirty years of investment in Trump has him squarely in their pocket.

- - - Updated - - -

Patriotism is the last refuge of a scoundrel.

Oh now that's a Vern Humphrey gem that we'll have to save for when Red questions my patriotism. Bookmarking this baby--

http://www.jouster2.com/forums/showt...who-to-believe

[Roadkingtrax]

Must be some pee tape...

[Dolt]

It's easy. Hillary Clinton loves herself, period. Trump loves himself and America, period. Obama and his ilk, including the deep state FBI and CIA tried to diminish if not destroy American influence in the world and they almost succeeded. May God damn the deep state and the left.

[togor]

Boy if the facts backed Dolt up then that would be quite a story. But aside from Hillary loving herself (not as much as Donald loves himself, but that's a high bar), everything else is back asswards. There will be people who continue to insist that Putin doesn't have Trump by the BBs, but they'll do so only by putting on blinders to the mounting pile of evidence. But that is nothing new.

Quick, anyone--compare our trade balance with Russia to what we have with Canada. Volume, % of deficit or surplus, any/all of it. Yet you never hear anyone talk about it. Hint: they sell us 3X as much as they buy from us. Way worse than Canada, or even Germany! Russia is killing us on trade!!!

[barretcreek]

What is Ivan selling us? Rocket engines, caviar, scandium (well, that's Ukraine), raw materials,what else? I think we made a big mistake in the '90s not helping Russia join the west economically. Vlado might just be pimp in Brighton Beach instead of in the Kremlin.

[togor]

What is Ivan selling us? Rocket engines, caviar, scandium (well, that's Ukraine), raw materials,what else? I think we made a big mistake in the '90s not helping Russia join the west economically. Vlado might just be pimp in Brighton Beach instead of in the Kremlin.

Well we put America First! in our dealings with Russia after winning the cold war. Per everything we are told today about running a foreign policy, that was a 100% correct move!!!

[PWC]

Watched them this morn when they came out to talk. Putin said Muller's team was free to come to Russia and sit in on thier interrogation of the 12. Also, said the 12 came to the USwith more than a $million and GAVE IT TO HIL'S CAMPAIGN! And requested for his people to sit in on our investigation/ interrogation. Why aren't the "unfair and unbalanced" reporting and investigating that?

I'll give Trump the benefit of the doubt. Still waiting for Muller to to bring forth the evidence. I believe Trump is skeptical enough and he knows Putin`s background in the KGB-GRU.

[Tuna]

One has to take what Trump may say with a grain of salt. While I am NOT a fan of his he has shown he will say one thing but does another. Take Rocket man for an example. No other President has made any headway with North Korea in the past and no US President will without the help of China. Right now Trump has angered China with his tariffs on their goods. They retaliate but China needs the US markets much more then the US needs Chinese markets. They may be angry with Trump BUT they will do as he asks otherwise their market shares drops like a rock and their economy starts to crumble. If they get Rocket man to end his nuclear program and missile production then Trump will end a lot of his tariffs and he gets what he wanted. Now with the Russians. He knows they are in this mess right up to their eyeballs. But again like with Rocket man he butters up Putin and makes like he doesn't think they are the bad guys. He has Putin over a barrel too as Putin wants and end to the US backed sanctions but until he gives into what Trump wants that isn't going to happen so right now it's a cat and mouse game with the Russians. But the everyday people are starting to feel some of the pressure from the sanctions. With more time this will build and when the pressure mounts enough Trump with get what he wants and that most likely is to get Iran out of Syria to prevent Israel from starting WW3 in the middle east with Iran. Trump is a frustrating SOB in what he does say and it makes me angry most times like it does with most other people. But having said that I do have to give him some credit. At least Americans are working again.

[Sandpebble]

question still stand .... who should we believe.... are you saying Putin ?? ....?????

[Sandpebble]

One has to take what Trump may say with a grain of salt. While I am NOT a fan of his he has shown he will say one thing but does another. Take Rocket man for an example. No other President has made any headway with North Korea in the past and no US President will without the help of China. Right now Trump has angered China with his tariffs on their goods. They retaliate but China needs the US markets much more then the US needs Chinese markets. They may be angry with Trump BUT they will do as he asks otherwise their market shares drops like a rock and their economy starts to crumble. If they get Rocket man to end his nuclear program and missile production then Trump will end a lot of his tariffs and he gets what he wanted. Now with the Russians. He knows they are in this mess right up to their eyeballs. But again like with Rocket man he butters up Putin and makes like he doesn't think they are the bad guys. He has Putin over a barrel too as Putin wants and end to the US backed sanctions but until he gives into what Trump wants that isn't going to happen so right now it's a cat and mouse game with the Russians. But the everyday people are starting to feel some of the pressure from the sanctions. With more time this will build and when the pressure mounts enough Trump with get what he wants and that most likely is to get Iran out of Syria to prevent Israel from starting WW3 in the middle east with Iran. Trump is a frustrating SOB in what he does say and it makes me angry most times like it does with most other people. But having said that I do have to give him some credit. At least Americans are working again.

"At least Americans are working again " ....as you say Tuna.

Permit me to point out that three years ago... "three years ago" I drove from Florida to northern New England . I passed endless housing developments under construction and it took me an extra day to get there as every stretch of highway and bridge was under construction. Those jobs didn't happen last year.

Funny that the infrastructure spending on those highways was opposed here on Culvers when it began under Obama ..... now the new guy talks infrastructure spending and we want to give him all the credit....

odd... thinks I

[Jiminvirginia]

All democratic countries meddle in each others elections to some degree. The difference here, as someplace else pointed out, the loser was supposed to be the shoe in. In my opinion HRC did not run a good campaign and Russia became the easy place to put the blame and undermine Trump.
No outsider influenced my vote, I have not cared for HRC since Putin was the coffee boy at the KGB.

[togor]

Tuna you are giving Trump way too much credit. The man plays the entire world for leverage save one country, who's intelligence services have a documented 30 year investment in him. And to do it his way, he has to cut out his entire staff, then publicly take a leak on his own LEOs in a joint press conference. Only one word does the situation justice. Kompromat. Occam's razor.

[Vern Humphrey]

I believe he's finally lost it!