Another interesting read

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  • RED
    Very Senior Member - OFC
    • Aug 2009
    • 11689

    #1

    Another interesting read

    From the USNA Alumni Blog:

    Posting by Major General Donald McGregor, USAF, Retired (University of MN 1981)

    Here's my take on Mattis resigning. First, he is a great American and one of the finest commanders the U.S. military has produced. I met him as brigadier general going through groom school. He was the CENTCOM commander at the time and full of piss and vinegar. We locked the doors and he gave our new class of one-star generals an excellent fire and brimstone speech about the middle east and our accomplishments...Motivating to say the least. I too was excited to see him as the SecDef. But also drew caution to his non-political view of the world and Trump's "America First" mantra.

    Former Generals should not write public policy. Trump fired Mattis (he didn't resign...you can bet he was told to get on board or else). Mattis is a product of the Cold War and Middle East conflicts. He is a career military person and we are seeing quite plainly why presidents should caution hiring generals into politically sensitive positions. It is foreign to them coming from an orderly (no pun) organization that believes in honor, selfless action and defending the nation...at all cost. To a general, politics is a weak man's sport and have little time for it. Unfortunately, it is real and much a part of the painful process in DC. You either get it and become the compromising person it requires or be exploited (LTG Flynn), unfit (LTG McMasters) or be frustrated (General Kelly and Mattis). In short, the reason Mattis believes in maintaining our positions in Syria, Afghanistan or our security alliances (NATO, etc.) is that he grew up in an environment based on non-strategic threats used to justify large military force structures (size)...non-strategic threat meaning not a threat to our survival.

    I personally was a part of DoD's strategic planning process to identify U.S. threats and subsequently justify the forces it needed to defeat or deny these threats. Much of our current security philosophy started after WII when the U.S. decided to create a Cold War out of ideological differences with the Soviet Union. Probably somewhat justified since communism's expansive nature was a legitimate threat. But after the wall fell, the Pentagon or military complex was in a pickle since the justification for forces was in jeopardy...i.e. we lost our main strategic threat and no longer needed the large forces it required? However, along came the Gulf War to the rescue which continues today for questionable reasons. It is these reasons that are important because it is the world Mattis grew up in and strongly influences his beliefs. In short, a belief that middle east security and alliances are essential for the U.S. to protect its global interests.

    Btw, we are the only nation on earth that feels compelled to build a security budget and force structure to accommodate a global security reach. So, what does one do in order to maintain its size, we make s%#t up!! Afghanistan, Syria, Iraq and for that matter Korea were never a strategic threat to the U.S. What I mean by strategic threat, is a threat so large that it challenges the survival of the U.S. Today, we only have one! Russia and its thousands of nuclear warheads pointed our way. This is the only strategic threat to the U.S. and the Pentagon woefully under budgets for its defense (I can tell you horror stories about the mismanagement of missile and airspace defense of the U.S.). As a matter of fact, we do not have a maritime or land defense plan for the U.S.!! Doesn't exist!! But we have several defense plans to defend our interests overseas! Hello? I fought these dysfunctional battles inside the Pentagon trying to get people to understand that defending our U.S. borders was our number one job! It was not our job to create threats that were really someone else's problem.

    ISIS, Al Queda, Syria, Korea, Afghanistan, or North Africa are NOT strategic threats to the U.S. and as we have painfully realized, not worth the blood and treasure we have spent trying to make them in our image. IT WON'T HAPPEN...because they don't want it! What Mattis may not realize is that this president actually understands this and promised the American people he would get us out of policing the world. He has stated this view repeatedly over the last 30 years...there should be no surprises!

    Trump is fighting a generation of generals, politicians, and analysts as well as a military complex who have seen only the world of large military budgets and foreign wars. Yes, we want a force capable of projecting anywhere in the world since we do not want to fight any war on our own property. But, the threats need to be strategic in nature, we need to force size to it, and then build an environment (partnerships or alliances) that can project it (bases, agreements, etc.)..and finally, train to it. Unfortunately, we have been caught up in unwarranted conflicts in areas where progress stopped 500 years ago, tribal customs dominate and democracy is misaligned with theological based customs and traditions. In other words, we won't change them because they can't even spell it!! Mattis is part of an old entrenched military complex that truly believes that terrorists and civil wars in godforsaken areas are a part of our strategic security direction. Well, guess what? There's a new sheriff in town who believes in America first, protect our borders, let others fight their own battles, and let those who want to work with us, pay for it!
  • S.A. Boggs
    Senior Member
    • Aug 2009
    • 8568

    #2
    Be careful with what you post Red, "our" military expert RKT will oppose you on this. I wonder how long it will take for RKT to Google something that will make him sound like the "expert" that he is.
    Personally I find the article enlightening to say the least...thanks for sharing it.
    Sam

    Comment

    • Allen
      Moderator
      • Sep 2009
      • 10583

      #3
      Originally posted by S.A. Boggs
      Be careful with what you post Red, "our" military expert RKT will oppose you on this. I wonder how long it will take for RKT to Google something that will make him sound like the "expert" that he is.
      Usually the response is within 5 minutes. This is all he has to do. This IS his work and what he is paid to do by the dims. If the reply is longer than 5 minutes he is probably responding to a thread on another conservative or gun forum.

      Comment

      • S.A. Boggs
        Senior Member
        • Aug 2009
        • 8568

        #4
        Originally posted by Allen
        Usually the response is within 5 minutes. This is all he has to do. This IS his work and what he is paid to do by the dims. If the reply is longer than 5 minutes he is probably responding to a thread on another conservative or gun forum.
        A very logical observation, much appreciated.
        Sam

        Comment

        • Roadkingtrax
          Senior Member
          • Feb 2010
          • 7835

          #5
          Originally posted by S.A. Boggs
          A very logical observation, much appreciated.
          Sam
          Logic.

          I'll take what Allen lacks for 200 Alex.
          "The first gun that was fired at Fort Sumter sounded the death-knell of slavery. They who fired it were the greatest practical abolitionists this nation has produced." ~BG D. Ullman

          Comment

          • Vern Humphrey
            Administrator - OFC
            • Aug 2009
            • 15875

            #6
            Too Loose LaTrack is in rare form today.

            Comment

            • Roadkingtrax
              Senior Member
              • Feb 2010
              • 7835

              #7
              Originally posted by Vern Humphrey
              Too Loose LaTrack is in rare form today.
              Thanks H&W.
              "The first gun that was fired at Fort Sumter sounded the death-knell of slavery. They who fired it were the greatest practical abolitionists this nation has produced." ~BG D. Ullman

              Comment

              • S.A. Boggs
                Senior Member
                • Aug 2009
                • 8568

                #8
                Originally posted by Roadkingtrax
                Thanks H&W.
                Apparently you are able to get back on the public computer @ your local library, how long can you be on?
                Sam

                Comment

                • togor
                  Banned
                  • Nov 2009
                  • 17610

                  #9
                  Yes, we want a force capable of projecting anywhere in the world since we do not want to fight any war on our own property.
                  A couple of points:

                  To project power with maximum effectiveness, forward bases are essential. That means means operating in foreign lands that are at least acquiescent, but preferably outright friendly. It also means having allies, locals who know the terrain. Yet the word "ally" is not found in the blog entry above in any of its forms, even as Mattis clearly understood the necessity of allies and the benefit of real friendship in shooting wars. To Trump there is no true friendship, only transactions of mutual benefit, but his is a distorted view of the world. Finally, the blog post fails to embody any of the true lessons of 9/11, which were unfortunately washed away by the Iraq war which is exactly the type of foreign adventure of which the post is rightly critical. One lesson of 9/11 is that ideological threats to open societies can originate from any corner of the globe and strike at them with their own devices. Another is to understand that of the greatest strategic advantages that the US had in the immediate post 9/11 aftermath was widespread feelilngs of international sympathy from friends and even ideological foes, over the slaughter of innocents. (Remember, it wasn't just Americans killed at the WTC.) We had it for a bit, used it to great advantage initially, and then pissed it away in the Iraq war. Nothing Trump has said or done since taking office has moved us even one millimeter in the direction of regaining that sort of international standing.

                  Comment

                  • RED
                    Very Senior Member - OFC
                    • Aug 2009
                    • 11689

                    #10
                    Originally posted by togor
                    A couple of points:

                    To project power with maximum effectiveness, forward bases are essential. That means means operating in foreign lands that are at least acquiescent, but preferably outright friendly. It also means having allies, locals who know the terrain. Yet the word "ally" is not found in the blog entry above in any of its forms, even as Mattis clearly understood the necessity of allies and the benefit of real friendship in shooting wars. To Trump there is no true friendship, only transactions of mutual benefit, but his is a distorted view of the world. Finally, the blog post fails to embody any of the true lessons of 9/11, which were unfortunately washed away by the Iraq war which is exactly the type of foreign adventure of which the post is rightly critical. One lesson of 9/11 is that ideological threats to open societies can originate from any corner of the globe and strike at them with their own devices. Another is to understand that of the greatest strategic advantages that the US had in the immediate post 9/11 aftermath was widespread feelilngs of international sympathy from friends and even ideological foes, over the slaughter of innocents. (Remember, it wasn't just Americans killed at the WTC.) We had it for a bit, used it to great advantage initially, and then pissed it away in the Iraq war. Nothing Trump has said or done since taking office has moved us even one millimeter in the direction of regaining that sort of international standing.

                    So you think you are a hell of a lot smarter than the accomplished Major General? That is just indicative of the "I love Lucy, and Lucy is me!" BS you spout every chance you get, Fook you! Your reply doesn't say a thing about the Russian, the Ukraines or anything else in my post. Liar, liar, twist and turn, hate and burn is all your stupid ass knows.
                    Last edited by RED; 01-09-2019, 03:07.

                    Comment

                    • togor
                      Banned
                      • Nov 2009
                      • 17610

                      #11
                      Didn't say I was smarter or not smarter. I point out that friendly foreign spaces have value if a military wants to operate with global reach, as the blog post makes no mention of that fact, and if anything echos the Trumpian line in the last sentence, which to be honest makes me wonder if the language is entirely his. On the other hand, his is a National Guard background, which is naturally more homeland-oriented, so maybe so. In any case, your reaction is way over the top.
                      Last edited by togor; 01-09-2019, 03:45.

                      Comment

                      • S.A. Boggs
                        Senior Member
                        • Aug 2009
                        • 8568

                        #12
                        Satellite overhead see's training camp, send info back to be processed. Orders go out to U.S. Navy sub who then fires off missiles to destroy camp, sub goes undetected. No need for boots on the ground, our people in the enemies line of fire, being killed by "friendly" troops, no infrastructure to maintain or "nation building" to do. Just U.S. Navy nuclear subs prowling coasts like a croc just waiting and waiting. In time goes back to base to be replenished while another sub takes it's place undetected.
                        Sam

                        Comment

                        • RED
                          Very Senior Member - OFC
                          • Aug 2009
                          • 11689

                          #13
                          Originally posted by togor
                          Didn't say I was smarter or not smarter. I point out that friendly foreign spaces have value if a military wants to operate with global reach, as the blog post makes no mention of that fact, and if anything echos the Trumpian line in the last sentence, which to be honest makes me wonder if the language is entirely his. On the other hand, his is a National Guard background, which is naturally more homeland-oriented, so maybe so. In any case, your reaction is way over the top.
                          That's because every time you post it is a chalk on the blackboard screeching, American hating tirade, of of nothing but blowhard, BS.

                          Come on and tell us about how Trump colluded with the Russians, and how many times has Trump bonked his daughter and his 11 year old son. Come on you coward and lecture us some more on how brilliant you are.

                          Comment

                          • togor
                            Banned
                            • Nov 2009
                            • 17610

                            #14
                            Disagree With Red = Hating An Entire Country

                            Vernon could call that narcissistic behavior on your part, but don't worry, he won't. But he could and he wouldn't be wrong.

                            Comment

                            • S.A. Boggs
                              Senior Member
                              • Aug 2009
                              • 8568

                              #15
                              Originally posted by togor
                              Disagree With Red = Hating An Entire Country

                              Vernon could call that narcissistic behavior on your part, but don't worry, he won't. But he could and he wouldn't be wrong.
                              WOW, besides being a "trained" battery changer now an authority on the DSM as well! Professor Freud must be smiling at your magnificent intellect!
                              Sam

                              Comment

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