How did the Gun Grabbers win in Virginia ? ...

[lyman]

Let me point out that the claim is bogus. The frame IS the gun. All frames are serial numbered. So he couldn't assemble a gun without a serial number that way.

you can with an 80% lower, which are available

most come with a jig attached to drill the holes needed, just add a parts kit and done,



no FFL needed

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Just another wrinkle on the gun discussion. Personally I'd buy the real thing legally because I figure the QC is better that way, and if I'm going to bet my life on it, I want it to work. But as the story says, for someone who can't/won't buy with a background check, then there is this. I would think states will start regulating kit guns if the Feds do not.

so no link, no video,,

[togor]

https://nyti.ms/2qUEZhR

May or may not be behind paywall or require watching an ad.

[lyman]

a bit of fail in that video,

[togor]

a bit of fail in that video,

No elaboration.

[lyman]

watch the video,

[togor]

watch the video,

I did, several times. It's fine. I don't see a soapbox piece by any means, unless you think that serializing the frames and requiring background checks for kits is radical liberalism run amok.

[lyman]

I did, several times. It's fine. I don't see a soapbox piece by any means, unless you think that serializing the frames and requiring background checks for kits is radical liberalism run amok.

lets just say tainted a bit,

ATF guy worried about safety of police officers and advocating the tracing system, which is not as successful as they admit on TV, unless the firearm was bought new and the original owner kept records when they got rid of it, (got this tidbit from an ATF person,,,)


picks a liberal NOVA politician who put the bill in,

and why not get the pistol permit in NY to prove a point?


the entire deal at the Loudon police dept was drama,,

I know a few local cops that would have taken it and tossed it in an evidence bag with this ID info and tossed it in the trunk of the cruiser and moved on,

[togor]

His main point is that a pencilneck like him could get it done, even crossing state lines, with no background check or laws broken, suggesting that the current statutes might need updating to put kit guns and complete guns on equal footing at the time of purchase. Boy what a loon, eh?

[lyman]

why impose more laws on something folks don't understand or abuse now?

what is the percentage of kits built or sold vs those caught in a crime?


if folks (Criminal) are getting caught with ghost guns, does that not suggest that our current laws are working and no need for more restrictions on gun owners?

[togor]

why impose more laws on something folks don't understand or abuse now?

what is the percentage of kits built or sold vs those caught in a crime?


if folks (Criminal) are getting caught with ghost guns, does that not suggest that our current laws are working and no need for more restrictions on gun owners?

To answer your question, one would need to get the kit makers to divulge their sales numbers to the government. That being the case, are you asking a real or a rhetorical question? We've done this dance before.

The Saugus High School shooting was a kit gun.

I wonder when some clever fellow will start making FA kit guns. If an unfinished kit is not a receiver, then a FA fire control part that won't fit anything can't be a MG part. Sure if the receiver or frame is finished then this fire control part could result in a FA capability, but that's purely hypothetical and no reason not to allow unregulated commerce in what is otherwise a kit and a piece of metal that otherwise won't fit in any known gun.

[lyman]

To answer your question, one would need to get the kit makers to divulge their sales numbers to the government. That being the case, are you asking a real or a rhetorical question? We've done this dance before.

The Saugus High School shooting was a kit gun.

I wonder when some clever fellow will start making FA kit guns. If an unfinished kit is not a receiver, then a FA fire control part that won't fit anything can't be a MG part. Sure if the receiver or frame is finished then this fire control part could result in a FA capability, but that's purely hypothetical and no reason not to allow unregulated commerce in what is otherwise a kit and a piece of metal that otherwise won't fit in any known gun.

the full auto stuff (in a AR type kit) has been done, there were some reports on that (if one can believe the reports) a year or so ago,

what difference does it make where or what type or gun was used in a school shooting?


remember, we already have laws that should be enforced to prevent those types of things happening,

[togor]

....sigh.....

You asked a question about kit guns and crimes. I gave but one example.

"We have laws...." is a phrase used to make it seem like someone is in favor of doing something. In anything, circumstances change and existing tools become obsolete. The fact that the old tools exist is immaterial, if re-tooling is needed to achieve the stated goals. Congress of course is pretty jammed up on firearms legislation, so when the Trump Administration decided it wanted to ban bump stocks, they went with the tried-and-true rule making process. Who knows, maybe someone will shoot up a hotel lobby with a kit gun and they'll decide to do the same thing with kits.

Is there a specific reason not to put S/Ns on kits and require a background check to purchase? Who would be harmed by such a regulation?

[Marty T.]

I just would like to know why it always comes around to the foolish notion of "the gun" did it. Why not make an example of the criminal by using the firing squad or electric chair, no delays, no waiting 20 years, just convict and execute. That would slow the use of guns or any other "thing" in crimes. As lyman and others have said, use the laws we have.

[lyman]

....sigh.....

You asked a question about kit guns and crimes. I gave but one example.

"We have laws...." is a phrase used to make it seem like someone is in favor of doing something. In anything, circumstances change and existing tools become obsolete. The fact that the old tools exist is immaterial, if re-tooling is needed to achieve the stated goals. Congress of course is pretty jammed up on firearms legislation, so when the Trump Administration decided it wanted to ban bump stocks, they went with the tried-and-true rule making process. Who knows, maybe someone will shoot up a hotel lobby with a kit gun and they'll decide to do the same thing with kits.

Is there a specific reason not to put S/Ns on kits and require a background check to purchase? Who would be harmed by such a regulation?

you sure do sigh a lot,,,,

you asked about full auto, I gave an example

we have laws in place, that if properly enforced, would have prevented a good portions of the crimes committed, the rest may not have been preventable at all,

yet you, so called (by your own words) conservative, want more legislature to legislate a thing, not the person using it, (smells a bit liberal to me ,, and others, )

kit or not, no law is broken if you make a firearm now,
I know a couple machinist that have done just that, starting with a bar of Steel,


it is perfectly legal to do so, (that means --------sigh--------- the government says you can) right now,


why waste funds on legislation not needed? does it make you feel better?

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I just would like to know why it always comes around to the foolish notion of "the gun" did it. Why not make an example of the criminal by using the firing squad or electric chair, no delays, no waiting 20 years, just convict and execute. That would slow the use of guns or any other "thing" in crimes. As lyman and others have said, use the laws we have.

project exile did a decent job of lowering crime (gang and drug related) here in VA,

[Gun Smoke]

I just would like to know why it always comes around to the foolish notion of "the gun" did it. Why not make an example of the criminal by using the firing squad or electric chair, no delays, no waiting 20 years, just convict and execute. That would slow the use of guns or any other "thing" in crimes. As lyman and others have said, use the laws we have.

Agree.

That's why our prisons are bursting at the seams and early releases granted. Our laws that are on the books aren't enforced enough. Capitol punishment should come automatically where the crime and evidence agree. Our prisons should be empty or near empty instead of overflowing. People should be scared to be arrested and jailed instead of it being considered just an occupational hazard. Felons should all do the time for the crime.

Some live for decades on death row and die in prison instead of being dealt with.

A crime is a crime. The liberals and news media try to brainwash that all crimes relate to the gun.