Pence

[togor]

The question I'm asking myself is whether or not Pence is calling the shots right now. The idea being some kind of agreement where Trump agrees to stay quiet for the last 12 days while Pence cleans stuff up in the agencies where there has been foot dragging on transition and plays nice with a Congress that is super PO'd right now.

Not nearly enough data yet, but 12 more days of being quiet would be a PR for Trump, beating his old record of 16 hours by far (when he had Covid).

So if it happens, if Trump keeps his yap shut the rest of the way, my sense will be that it only happened because they had serious leverage on him. The kids bear watching too.

Last big story to watch now will be the pardons. Will he try the self-pardon? It will be challenged in court by Biden and he'll have a lot of support from Conservatives.

[Major Tom]

I don't see a big deal pardons as every out going president has done it and some were outlandish.
When Biden takes over the investigation of Hunter will stop! Imagine that!

[togor]

MT the rumored self-pardon would break new ground.

[Tuna]

If Trump steps down before his time is up then Mike Pence could in theory step in and pardon Trump.

[togor]

If Trump steps down before his time is up then Mike Pence could in theory step in and pardon Trump.

Absolutely true.

Two things about it:

1. To accept a pardon is to admit guilt in the matter.

2. A pardoned person cannot claim a 5th Amendment right against self-incrimination if called to testify about what happened, say by Congress. To refuse to testify is a fresh offense not covered by the pardon.

Pence would have to weigh the pros and cons to himself. Some would consider him a hero, others would say it confirms him as Trump's lickspittle.

Added:

Nixon fell on his sword and promised to go back to California and not make any fuss. The story is he wasn't so sure about accepting the pardon, but once he had time to think about it, decided it was better than the alternative.

It's hard to imagine Trump going anywhere and keeping quiet about it. For that reason the the down side risk to Pence is greater than it was to Gerald Ford. I'm too young to know if that pardon contributed to his loss to Jimmy Carter.

[k arga]

Pence should be tarred and feathered.

[Roadkingtrax]

Pence should be tarred and feathered.

Why?

[S.A. Boggs]

If Trump steps down before his time is up then Mike Pence could in theory step in and pardon Trump.

Who is going to pardon Hunter or slo joe?
Sam

[lyman]

Who is going to pardon Hunter or slo joe?
Sam

Kamala

[k arga]

he is a traitor, reply to rt (rest edited out)

[Roadkingtrax]

he is a traitor, reply to rt ....

Ah, Thanks. I thought you had something interesting to say.

[k arga]

there is not a damn thing interesting about you

[Roadkingtrax]

there is not a damn thing interesting about you

Your loss, not mine.

[Sandpebble]

he is a traitor, reply to rt (rest edited out)

Pence might be a traitor to Trump and we'll believe it because Trump says so.... right?

but so far as I can see Pence has no been traitorous to The United States of America. That trumps a Trump any day in my book .

[JB White]

Right now Pence ii in damage control mode and it isn't easy. Trumps policies might stand but his personality and antics are under fire. He loved giving the left a taste of their own medicine and I always felt his tweets were designed to piss people off.

Pence is in the same predicament Ford was. The President is in deep kimchee and the good of the nation is at stake. Long term. Not today's emotional crucify someone for something right now crap.

I've always leaned conservative. My mother was one of the early teeth gnashing, scream in your face, liberals. Always. Crusading the latest feel good cause no matter the damage from the wake.
My step father was a Truman Democrat. One of the last real Democrats in my opinion

I voted for Ford and he voted for Carter. He and I could talk politics without a fight. He wasn't a Carter fan either but Carter was a Dem. So....
There was one major thing that cost Ford the election. Then a smaller thing used only to reinforce the first.
First was he pardoned Nixon. Distant second was "He was never elected anyway".
Even my stepfather recognised the fact Ford did the best for the nation at the time. Remembering the 70s as I do, I agree. I just hope history shows Pence did the right thing in his time.