45 ACP case flash hole revelations

[Matt Anthony]

From OP: "I checked all 1450 cases and came up with 33 Winchester and 14 Federal. These were once fired cases taken from our range."

Ok, so 3.2 percent of what I assume may have been free range brass had the large flash holes. If someone modified them, I guess they were not once fired. In any event, just sort them out and don't shoot them. If they were free you are still a winner. If not maybe you can get a discount if they are not within proper specifications.

I get thousands of cases each month from two police ranges and our club. I recycle probably 30 lbs. a month in dented, split, primer blowout and cases which have loose pockets. It's not the fact that on this batch I am losing 3.2%, I let go another 150 for other reasons. I posted about the fact there wasn't enough material to support a primer, that was my concern and the fact that when comparing other flash holes, some of the W/W and Federal had larger than normal flash holes. I'm sorry I used the words disturbing and warning, evidently some readers don't like those words, alarming is another word that strikes fear in the hearts of sensitive reloaders. I am so sick of "political correctness", I could puke!
I read the last two posts, one from you and the other from parashooter. I have read for years both of your posts and both of you are very well educated in reloading and I have enjoyed reading your replies to others.
My post was intended to be informational on what I observed when sorting brass. I wasn't asking anyone if I should use them or reload them. I have sold brass for 40 years and know what to sell to others, and enlarged flash holed brass gets tossed. If it's larger than .090 it's history. Thanks for all the great advice!
Matt

[Hefights]

Hey man its all good. Merry Christmas!

[Varmintpopper]

Both of You... Go to Your rooms !!

[Matt Anthony]

Both of You... Go to Your rooms !!

I did go to my room and thought about the entire thread and why I bothered to post something that I found profoundly odd. Not a worry, I won't post anymore, it's not a problem at all! And the pictures of the flash holes, why bother, most would say they were drilled or speculate other fairy tale ways they could of become this way! Who cares!
Matt

[PhillipM]

I'd still like to see a picture or have you relate what the measured diameter of the holes are.

[PhillipM]

Like this?

[Parashooter]

. . . There are too many of us emphasizing exaggerated dangers and not enough promulgating a reasoned and encouraging approach to the art.

After the holidays, I'll open up a few .45 ACP flash holes and see what effect it has on firing an otherwise normal load. I suspect it won't be much in this fairly low-intensity cartridge.

This afternoon I drilled out three .45 cases to see what would happen. The first was with a .185" drill and it was obvious that the .0125" (.210"-.185"/2) shelf remaining at the bottom of the primer pocket wasn't enough to support the anvil. The other two were drilled .154". I loaded up the three cases with WLP primers, 4.5 grains Red Dot, and 230-grain cast RN bullets. With some trepidation and a leather glove, I then fired them in a spare 1911 (Auto. Ord. frame, Colt commercial barrel and slide).

The one drilled .185" did not fire on the first attempt but did with a second strike. The other two (.154" flash holes) fired normally. There was no evidence of any hazard or excess pressure during firing, ejection, or when examining the fired cases. Although this is a small sample and by no means definitive, I'm reasonably convinced enlarged flash holes in fact pose no particular danger with otherwise reasonable loads in .45ACP.

[Matt Anthony]

This afternoon I drilled out three .45 cases to see what would happen. The first was with a .185" drill and it was obvious that the .0125" (.210"-.185"/2) shelf remaining at the bottom of the primer pocket wasn't enough to support the anvil. The other two were drilled .154". I loaded up the three cases with WLP primers, 4.5 grains Red Dot, and 230-grain cast RN bullets. With some trepidation and a leather glove, I then fired them in a spare 1911 (Auto. Ord. frame, Colt commercial barrel and slide).

The one drilled .185" did not fire on the first attempt but did with a second strike. The other two (.154" flash holes) fired normally. There was no evidence of any hazard or excess pressure during firing, ejection, or when examining the fired cases. Although this is a small sample and by no means definitive, I'm reasonably convinced enlarged flash holes in fact pose no particular danger with otherwise reasonable loads in .45ACP.

I have an .080 pin guage that I use to check flash hole diameter. I also have many tools that deburr the inside of the flash hole that do not disturb the diameter of the flash hole. There is a reason for the diameter to be what it is, I believe it's support for the primer inself and for over pressure situations where the primer could be blown out easier with the larger hole. I could be wrong, and that's OK too.
Regardless of your test, I will continue to check flash hole diameter and continue to cull cases where the hole is enlarged. If anything, being consistant is the art to accuracy.

On the subject of flashholes, I have a friend who bought some foreign 223 brass. Looking at the brass, I noticed not one flash hole was centered in the primer pocket. Everyone of them were off center, some very close to the inner primer cup support, not touching but quite close. I mentioned this to him and he said it was normal and the manufacturer said the same! OK......

My son in law bought some 380 acp hard cast bullets from a Wisconsin company. On the box it states, 95 gr. hard cast, sized to .356. I use M dies for expanding case mouths and from the get go I was having trouble seating the bullets straight. I checked the diameter of the bullets,
.357 +. I used a starrett and a central tool caliper which I use in my machine shop and the tools are right on. Calling the company was useless, it's ok that they were .357 the owner said. When I mentioned that we were having a hard time loading them, he told me that they do it all the time without a problem. I asked him why he didn't label them .357, he told me they were sized in a .356 and they must of swelled! OK, however, resizing them to .356 caused them to load normal after using the M die.

Parashooter: I will watch what I post in the future so as not to alarm others so no one has a fit or mental breakdown!
Matt

[JimF]

. . . . Calling the company was useless, it's ok that they were .357 the owner said. When I mentioned that we were having a hard time loading them, he told me that they do it all the time without a problem. I asked him why he didn't label them .357, he told me they were sized in a .356 and they must of swelled! . . . .

Don't-cha just LOVE IT . . . . . when the person on the other end of the phone allows his "eyes to glaze over" when you are trying to correct, what should be to them, a MAJOR flaw in their product! --Jim