appropriate or not...???

[Don Steele]

I have recently acquired an 1873 Trapdoor rifle. The serial number indicates it was manufactured at Springfield in 1875. 56xxx range. Top of breechblock has the eagle head, "model 1873", crossed arrows, US on it. I've taken 15 pics. of this rifle and would enjoy having some of the experts here review them to see if this rifle is pretty much original, or if it might be some sort of "bubba". IF it is a "bubba-gun"..it is an older version. This rifle was in my Uncle's gun cabinet in his bedroom in Grandpa and Grandma's house when he left for the Marine Corps. in 1941. He flew Corsairs in the Pacific and didn't return. The rifle stayed at the Grandparents house until it was finally passed to one of my cousins, then on his passing...to one of his children, who had zero interest in it, so it went to me. Over the years...we've fired it a VERY few times with appropriately low powered ammo. I've been loading BPCR cartridges for some time, and will try to get her to shoot with a blackpowder/cast lead alloy bullet combo.
What would be the appropriate way to get some opinions..???
Thank You,
Don

[11mm]

I have recently acquired an 1873 Trapdoor rifle. The serial number indicates it was manufactured at Springfield in 1875. 56xxx range. Top of breechblock has the eagle head, "model 1873", crossed arrows, US on it. I've taken 15 pics. of this rifle and would enjoy having some of the experts here review them to see if this rifle is pretty much original, or if it might be some sort of "bubba". IF it is a "bubba-gun"..it is an older version. This rifle was in my Uncle's gun cabinet in his bedroom in Grandpa and Grandma's house when he left for the Marine Corps. in 1941. He flew Corsairs in the Pacific and didn't return. The rifle stayed at the Grandparents house until it was finally passed to one of my cousins, then on his passing...to one of his children, who had zero interest in it, so it went to me. Over the years...we've fired it a VERY few times with appropriately low powered ammo. I've been loading BPCR cartridges for some time, and will try to get her to shoot with a blackpowder/cast lead alloy bullet combo.
What would be the appropriate way to get some opinions..???
Thank You,
Don

Put the pictures where Dick Hosmer of this forum can see them. The rest of us would like to also, but Dick is the man around here for such evaluations.

[Dick Hosmer]

Yes, I'd be happy to have a look at it.

56,000 would be late 1875. If you want me to look it up in the limited data available, I'll need the complete number.

If it is "as made" it should look VERY similar, particularly as to sight and stock profile, to #12313 at www.picturetrail.com/sa4570af Yours will have the stacking swivel on the upper band however, which came out after mine was built.

[Don Steele]

I appreciate the offer to take a look. I have posted 8 pics in a public album on my profile. All comments appreciated.

[Dick Hosmer]

Thanks for sharing the pictures. It's a nice-looking rifle.

(1) While not a Bubba in the worst sense of the term - in that nothing has been chopped off (one of Bubba's signature tricks) - there have been numerous parts replaced, and the entire rifle seems to have been refinished, outside of government auspices. The stock is a later one; 1877 at least - could be even later than that. Does the wood fit tight and flush against the barrel AND the receiver, or is there a step on either side of the latter, enough to admit a couple of business cards?

(2) The hammer is post-1880.

(3) The rear sight (a Model 1879) could have been a proper arsenal upgrade - IF it is fastened with slotless screws.

(4) The lower barrel band is for the even-later (1884+) Buffington rear sight, the leaf of which fits into the milled notch. You will find that the upper band will fit better if the "U" is on the right side - the bands are tapered; I think the lower band is on correctly.

(5) The muzzle appears to have been filed flat? If there is a crown, it doesn't seem to show, but that could just be the lighting. Rifling looks good and strong; could be a fun shooter. Didn't see (couldn't read) the serial number.

(6) The most interesting feature, to me, is the small cartouche on the stock between the lock screws. In nearly 45 years of collecting, I have NEVER seen such a mark in that location. Can you take a SHARP close-up? I can see the remains of the normal cartouche behind the rear lock screw, which would date the stock to 1879 at least, and that would mean there almost certainly IS a step/gap in the inletting - see (1) - at the receiver.

Hope that helps.

[70ish]

Not sure, but I think the ramrod is a later version.

[Don Steele]

Thank you for the examination and comments. I have added a second album to my profile in an attempt to address the questions raised. The cartouche in the "normal" position has some initials and the date 1890. Also, on the top of the stock comb next to the metal butt plate is a "90" stamped into the wood. The more interesting cartouche Dick asked about is clearly the letters N.J. Those letters also appear stamped on the left side of the receiver although the pic didn't come out too well. I posted pics of both ends of the cleaning rod if that helps to clarify its vintage. also got a decent pic of the muzzle. The sight appears to have all slotted screws in it.
I can't get a good pic of the receiver inletting. There's not a gross gap there, but I have no frame of reference.
Once again...thanks for the comments.
I have some BP rounds loaded that I shoot in an 1885 Browning BPCR...I'm looking forward to seeing how they do. Sadly, my eyes aren't what they used to be, and the sight is less than ideal.

[Dick Hosmer]

Not sure, but I think the ramrod is a later version.

You are absolutely correct.

[Don Steele]

Range report:
I had a bunch of BPCR rounds already loaded so they were used to see how she would do. The load is: 67 gns. Goex 2f Win. LR mag. primer, 490 +/- 1.0 gn NEI "Badger-Browning" bullet, 30:1 alloy, SPG lube.
From 50 yds, off sandbags...after getting the POI figured out, and digging up my Merit Eye disc to help with the gawd-awful sights on this rifle...I got 3 successive rounds to print inside the black in a 1 1/4" group.
PLENTY good enough to make "minute-of-whitetail" in S.E. Georgia. This old girl may be going to the Deer-Woods with me this Fall..!!

[Don Steele]

Additional detail I left out. The NEI bullets were sized to .459. Certainly grouped well enough to think about hunting, but I'm going to try some unsized/ "as cast", to see if they do any better.
ALSO: Here's the issue...P.O.I. (as expected) is about 8 in. high @ 50 yds. The front sight on this rifle does not appear to have any "pin" in it to drive out and replace the blade with something higher.
I'd like to know how others have dealt with this.
Thanks again.

[Dick Hosmer]

The two-piece sight was 2-3 years in the future when your barrel was made. For target shooting, stack two targets vertically. Aim at the low one, impact on the high one - adjust separation until you get it right. For hunting, work up a load that hits point of aim, or hold low. Assuming you hunt at modest ranges, that shouldn't be too hard, unless you get flustered with "buck fever". :-)

[Don Steele]

Thanks once again Dick. You've been a great help. I appreciate your willingness to share your knowledge. For target shooting, I don't care where the group goes...just how good and reproducible it is. Where I hunt, in S.E. Georgia...most shots are around 50 yds, some less. Holding on the bottom edge of a deer's chest, with maybe a thin sliver of daylight showing, ought to put that 500 gn lump-O-lead right where it needs to go.
At this point, I'm going to just keep shooting it like it is, and enjoy.