Antique RR watch

[Merc]

Art,

I can read Walter Starcke on the movement. What does the rest say?

[Art]

Art,

I can read Walter Starcke on the movement. What does the rest say?

It says

Walter Starcke
Junction City Kans
17 Jewels

That is the only lettering on the movement.

The research I did shows that the Starcke family operated a high end jewelry and sundries store in Junction City from the mid 1880s to the late 1950s. It also had an optometrist shop. The founder, Walter Starcke was a jeweler and watchmaker. Judging from the Illinois Watch Case Company Spartan case and the art deco looking damascening I suppose it was made between 1920 and the start of WWII. The movement is in the 5,700,000 range which seems to be proof positive that the movement was not made by Starcke.

I have only seen one other reference to one of these watches. An auction in the U.K. had a "very rare Walter Starcke" watch for sale, same face but a different case. No on line sites I have found have any reference to these watches. My horologist friend suggested that I post pictures and a description on watchuseek and that was a complete bust as well.

Oh, it is a lever set.

[Art]

11-22-14 Starcke Jewelry house Windows 1.jpg

The Starcke store in its heyday.

[Merc]

It’s unusual that a manufacturer would exclude their name or model number from the watch. I checked the serial number of the watch against the serial numbers used by the two largest US companies (Elgin and Waltham) and they both blew past the 5 million mark in the 1890s. Yours appears to be an early 1900s to 1920s high quality watch. The 17j, 16s, lever set, spade and whip hands, a white dial with large black numbers and a red seconds chapter, would suggest a specialty purpose (i.e. some possible limited approved RR use). Will keep looking.

[Art]

One of the watches in my cousin's house was a "Plymouth." It is a very small ladies watch in a 14k solid gold case. Unfortunately it was not repairable. It was, as I recall, marked "Plymouth Watch Company" on the movement.

I found that these watches were made by Rockford and Illinois for Sears Roebuck in the first decade of the 20th century but are not marked as such. Sears was such a big operation then that the knowledge of the makers of the Sears Roebuck watches is common knowledge while the watches made for a single store in Kansas would not be. Sears Roebuck in their ads claims that their 17 j watches are superior to 21j watches produced by the "maker." Obviously the manufacturer(s) of the Plymouth watches wouldn't want their name on a Sears watch with a claim like that!!!

[Merc]

Art,

I enlarged the movement photo and I can only see six numbers in the serial number.

[Art]

Art,

I enlarged the movement photo and I can only see six numbers in the serial number.

You are correct. I looked at the serial number under a magnifier and it is indeed 570493. I mistakenly thought there was a 1 after the 3.

Rockford hit 570,000 in 1900-1901 but it's hard to believe this watch is that old.

[Merc]

Art,

You may never be able to identify the manufacturer. I looked through my watch books and Rockford is a possibility although I didn’t see the exact same watch. The English and Swiss were exporting movements so it could be one of theirs. Old Walt must have sold quite a few movements in order to get a manufacturer to put his name on the movement instead of their name.

[Art]

Art,

You may never be able to identify the manufacturer. I looked through my watch books and Rockford is a possibility although I didn’t see the exact same watch. The English and Swiss were exporting movements so it could be one of theirs. Old Walt must have sold quite a few movements in order to get a manufacturer to put his name on the movement instead of their name.

I'm afraid you're right. The chance of finding anything like this on a small business operating 100 years ago, no matter how prosperous is slim and none and I'm afraid slim has left town.

Thank you for your help and insight. I appreciate it.

[Merc]

Here’s one you don’t see often. It’s a big 1912 Waltham 18s 15j in an unusual case. The movement and case are attached with a hinge that allows it to swing out from the case. 15 jewels was considered high quality in 1912. Still runs and keeps great time. This was someone’s daily watch for many years (notice the crown is worn smooth and the brassing on the back of the case from pocket wear).

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[Merc]

One more.BE649489-D8FD-4196-9C38-65A37B630003.jpg

[Merc]

AB4E319B-AED7-48CC-A363-0388B5EF11C3.jpg

Four watches; three Elgin’s and one Waltham; all size 12 from the 1920s. The three Elgins are 17j movements, the Waltham is 15j (far left). No more white porcelain dials on watches from this era. They all have painted metal dials. None are particularly rare, so the book value is pretty cheap even though they are considered high quality watches. Second from the left is my dad’s Elgin with a refinished dial.

Interesting story about the Waltham. I picked it at an estate sale a few years ago and it ran but was really slow. I took the back cover off and the movement looked clean and normal. I took the front bezel off and saw something sticking up out of the sub seconds hand hole. I got a pair of tweezers and pulled at it and to my surprise, out came a human hair that had to be 8 inches long that was wound completely around the seconds post. How it got there is anyone’s guess. The watch runs fine now.

[Merc]

I walked into a huge antique mall in Fort Myers, FL the other day and there was another railroad watch calling my name. The asking price was less than one half of the usual market price for this watch and the seller accepted my offer that trimmed another 30%, so it followed me home. This one is a nice running 1950 Elgin 571 grade 21j 16s with a minty movement and perfect dial. It was the final railroad grade pocket watch that Elgin would produce. The photos show the grade 571 and the previously purchased and nearly perfect 1939 Elgin grade 540 23j 16s. Of course, I suspect there was a reason that the price for the 571 was so cheap. The case is without brassing and adequately contains the movement but the bow shows considerable wear (very loose) and the rim has a few dings that are all probably consistent with 20-30 or more years of daily service. A minty case occasionally surfaces on eBay that might push the cost up closer to maybe 60% to 70% of its true value, but I wont bother looking for one. I’d rather keep the original. Maybe i’ll wear it.

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The 571 is on the right.

[Merc]

Secret message in Lincoln’s pocket watch.

http://www.pocketwatchrepair.com/histories/lincoln.html

[Merc]

Some interesting watches.

Edit:

IMHO, these watches may be worth every penny just because of the rarity, materials, complications plus they are beautiful engineering marvels, but the American railroad watch went to work and kept excellent time every day for 40 or more years.

https://moneyinc.com/most-expensive-pocket-watches-ever-made/