Rock Island Auction RB M1903

[Kragrifle]

Nope. I have seen this TG on every good RB 1903.

[Fred]

Beats me. I'm no expert. I've seen at least five period pictures that seems to show a normal trigger guard. None that show an elongated trigger guard. All the photo's of the undisputedly unaltered and original Rod Bayonet 03's that've sold for seriously big money to advanced collectors have the normal trigger guard. The detailed drawing of the trigger guard in the 1904 Rod Bayonet manual shows a normal trigger guard. Beats me...

[Fred]

Here are some wonderful period photographs that I've borrowed from my copy of the book, Rock Island Rifle Model 1903, written by Nick Ferris. These photo's definitely show the normal trigger guard. The drawing is out of the 1904 printing of "Description And Rules For The Management Of The U.S. Magzine Rifle, Model Of 1903, Caliber .30"
It too shows the normal trigger guard.

[Fred]

[Kragrifle]

HI Fred,
Pretty convincing I must say. Still I have observed the triggerguard with the parallel sides on a 5 or 6 RB rifles, and have made a point of noting the shape. An interesting point about the guard on my rifle is that the sear is not released when the trigger is pushed forward. This was the problem with the RB rifles and why the pin was added. It has been more than 20 years since I took my rifle apart, but as I remember my rifle does not have the pin.

[Fred]

I've read that about half (50 or so) of the 100 RB rifles known to exist have been assembled from original parts where possible. The other half (50 or so) are original to form and have never been modified or converted. On the rifles that I've seen that have been assembled from parts, most would look pretty good from a distance, but a closer inspection would show some later or updated parts. Some have a 30-06 barrel that was used because a 30-03 barrel couldn't be found. Some have a serrated button for the bayonet release which were used on the experimental long rifles. Some have later stocks that've been altered by having wood added to them. Some have the later split rear band. Most have two part rear sights. Some have later butt plates with the large trap door. Some have the later trigger guard. Some have Krag sight leafs. etc. etc. These rifles never seem to go for the high dollar amounts that an original rifle will bring. I knew when I bought my rifle that it had been assembled with primarily original parts. However, there were still a lot of little parts that needed to be replaced with original Rod Bayonet parts. Except for two remaining hard to notice features, the original Rod Bayonet parts that were missing were found and installed. It being an assembled rifle, my rifle didn't cost $50,000.00 or higher like an all original rifle would've. It only cost me a little over $2,000.00. I think that the stock alone is worth more than that, so I feel I did OK on the deal.
I'm very fortunate that it's one of the 100 or so RB rifles that are known. AND of course it has a 30-03 barrel. THAT's always a good thing as Forest Gump would say. I was LUCKY that it did and that it also had an original RB stock. The auction description said that the rifle was assembled from Bannerman parts when such were available long ago. Well, they often say anything for a sale. However, I would imagine that such parts might've been available through Bannerman's up to any time before WWII. Beats me. Maybe around 1910 or so. Who knows...
Not being able to look at them myself and not being much of an expert on 03's or anything else, I'm just wondering if the rifles you mentioned seeing with the elongated trigger guards might possibly have been reassembled long ago using as many original parts as used to be possible, including any surplus Model 1900 and maybe some other experimental or trial parts. You're convinced they appear to be original and all legit. They might just be that. Maybe not completely. However because they have a trigger guard that was never known to be on any issue rifle, let alone a documented and original RB rifle, experimental or otherwise, I will have to conclude that the rifles are possibly not entirely original in construction.
Now it's possible that the trigger guard on your rifle is an unknown experimental type that was used with other original parts to build your rifle. Maybe it was actually one of several rifles that the long trigger guards were mounted on. Lots of experiments were being done then at Springfield Armory. If so, then you should follow up on that and see what you find. The elongated trigger guard is normal at the front and is elongated towards the back. There shouldn't have been any reason for this to be a Winter Trigger Guard to facilitate the use of gloves because it doesn't allow for any extra room for the gloved finger to fit into the trigger guard. All of the extra room is at the Back of the guard, as if there were plans for it to be mated with a double set trigger. Is the trigger slot longer than on a normal trigger guard?
Anyone who wants to can certainly keep such a trigger guard on their rifle. However, until more is understood about them, I'd personally be more than a little cautious in concluding that such trigger guards were standard issue on Rod Bayonet 1903's. The evidence I've seen just doesn't point to it.

By the way, I'd really be interested in seeing your rod bayonet rifle! Got any pictures? I never get to see enough of the type! They're All neat!

Fred

[Kragrifle]

Bought the rifle more than 25 years ago. I disassembled it and inspected every part. Cartouche is script FC which should be correct for the end of production. As I seen this TG on every RB that looked correct I was satisfied, though I did note that it would not "fire" when the trigger was pushed forward .
Will be in Baltimore this WE and gone the following week so it will be awhile before I can do a lot. If you want, send me your email and I'll send you a few photos.

[Kragrifle]

had seen

[Southron]

I noticed that the patina on the receiver and rear sight collar does not match the patina on the rod bayonet and front barrel band. Both parts seem to be almost brand new or original spare parts that have been in continuous storage, covered with cosmoline that preserved their original finish

[Fred]

If you're referring to the bayonet and front barrel band in the two Bottom photo's, they show the front area on my rifle. I posted them for a comparison with the rifle being auctioned to show the flat area of the RB stacking swivel.