Gun control again?

[blackhawknj]

50 years ago we had the guns, we didn't have the drugs. In the 1970s there were all the stories of the "Crazed Vietnam Vet", most were found to be non-combat veterans, drug users-many never served in Vietnam, disciplinary problems, saw an OTH discharge as an "early out", found there was a stigma, getting it upgraded was not merely an administrative matter.
In today's military, not training for combat, no warrior ethos, fighting spirit, if a solider has "problems" he's sent to Psych Eval, that creates a CYA paper trail for the chain of command, let them pass the problem onto someone else. "He stopped taking his meds!"

[S.A. Boggs]

Wait...how am I responsible for this Sam? Me or anyone else here? That deserves clarification.

It is simple, often when a motion is placed for a vote to fund mental health the motion often fails. I understand money is tight and many "worthy" things clamor for funding. Mental health is often not funded or defunded to "save" money. Society will often pay for prisons but not mental health.
Sam

[togor]

In today's military, not training for combat, no warrior ethos, fighting spirit, if a solider has "problems" he's sent to Psych Eval, that creates a CYA paper trail for the chain of command, let them pass the problem onto someone else. "He stopped taking his meds!"

This is a military training failure? From everything I've heard the all-volunteer force takes to training much more energetically and professionally than did the conscript force. Not saying his time in uniform had nothing to do with it, but also not clear that it did. Some 28 year olds who never served have problems too.

[RED]

Crazy, insane, people do crazy insane things. Politicians, movie stars, great athletes, renown scientists, and military hero's, can be, and are subject to mental illness. Unfortunately there are crazy, insane people that believe only conservatives/Republicans are responsible for the actions of every crazy, insane, person that exists.

[Jiminvirginia]

Odd. I've known veterans from WW1 on up. Some were on the the "other" side. Don't remember any of them being likely to do this type of thing. Is there something else going on here?

[Vern Humphrey]

Odd. I've known veterans from WW1 on up. Some were on the the "other" side. Don't remember any of them being likely to do this type of thing. Is there something else going on here?

You have to remember, to be a leftist is to be a bigot. One group they are bigoted against is veterans. Senator Diane Feinstein has said NO veterans should be allowed to posses firearms, since they ALL have PTSD, which she believes originated in the Gulf War.

Note -- pioneers crossing the plains in the 1840s suffered from PTSD, which is mentioned in "Sweet Betsy from Pike." And Civil War records show abundant PTSD.

[Jiminvirginia]

You have to remember, to be a leftist is to be a bigot. One group they are bigoted against is veterans. Senator Diane Feinstein has said NO veterans should be allowed to posses firearms, since they ALL have PTSD, which she believes originated in the Gulf War.

Note -- pioneers crossing the plains in the 1840s suffered from PTSD, which is mentioned in "Sweet Betsy from Pike." And Civil War records show abundant PTSD.

But did they snap and kill a bunch of innocent people?

One of my theories is that the rise of organized terrorism has devalued human life.

[Vern Humphrey]

But did they snap and kill a bunch of innocent people?

Not so far as I know. My points are:

1. PTSD is nothing new.
2. People with PTSD are no more likely to be violent than anyone else.
3. Diane Feinstein is a nutcase.

One of my theories is that the rise of organized terrorism has devalued human life.

Indeed it has.

[togor]

It is simple, often when a motion is placed for a vote to fund mental health the motion often fails. I understand money is tight and many "worthy" things clamor for funding. Mental health is often not funded or defunded to "save" money. Society will often pay for prisons but not mental health.
Sam

I don't recall seeing the motion come up for a vote in our mob democracy. Your collective responsibility argument falls flat. What next? Collective punishment?

[blackhawknj]

In the Civil War, WWI, WWII you didn't have the young watching violent movies, video games, etc.
Roe v. Wade has done more to devalue human life in this country than anything else.
"Mental Health"-define THAT ! Being homeless, a drug user, ignoring standards of sanitation, etc? THAT'S not a mental health issue ?

[Vern Humphrey]

In the Civil War, WWI, WWII you didn't have the young watching violent movies, video games, etc.
Roe v. Wade has done more to devalue human life in this country than anything else.
"Mental Health"-define THAT ! Being homeless, a drug user, ignoring standards of sanitation, etc? THAT'S not a mental health issue ?

Pretty hard to argue with you.

But there really is only a tenuous link between mental health and violence. "Mental health" is like gun control in one aspect -- it is a knee jerk attempt to find a quick solution to a complex problem.

[S.A. Boggs]

I don't recall seeing the motion come up for a vote in our mob democracy. Your collective responsibility argument falls flat. What next? Collective punishment?

There you go again with your NAZI ideation of "democracy", when will you ever learn?
Sam

[S.A. Boggs]

I don't recall seeing the motion come up for a vote in our mob democracy. Your collective responsibility argument falls flat. What next? Collective punishment?

Collective punishment appears to be here now. Now you with your fine "trained" education what would you do? All of us learned people would like to know!
Sam

[togor]

Boggs you've tied yourself in knots again, oblivious to the contradictions in your own posts, and resistant to gentle attempts to help you see the light. No, I do not take responsibility for the recent tragic shooting. Nor do most here, I suspect. If you want to keep banging that drum, be my guest.

[S.A. Boggs]

Boggs you've tied yourself in knots again, oblivious to the contradictions in your own posts, and resistant to gentle attempts to help you see the light. No, I do not take responsibility for the recent tragic shooting. Nor do most here, I suspect. If you want to keep banging that drum, be my guest.

Togor, "we" clamor for safety, security and demand our government do "something" the question is what? A person is either part of the solution or the cure. Then there are people who just like to bitch and moan not wanting to do anything but that. I have been doing something about the problem of violence for the last 20 years, what have you done?
Sam