Trump To Throw Kurds Under Turkish Bus

[dryheat]

Alright, some "live fire" practice. A little rough, but I'm sure you will work it out.
Sandpebble expressed a genuine feeling of respect for a rare thread that was well written and spoken. But Art doesn't spew nonsense and Togor isn't an idiot(Oh'boy, I might be in trouble; I said, he isn't an idiot).

[bostonbound]

I just got a warning from Jouster { Lyman } for insulting other members here on this forum with what I wrote above......

now that is very interesting .....

Does this mean the new moderation policy is working? Good!

You could have made your point without the personal insults.

[Clark Howard]

There happens to be only two sides illustrated by this question. Only one side wants the forum to survive. The other is only here to destroy.

[togor]

Back to the OP, is it okay to cite the Kurds' lack of military action with us in WW2 as an objectively ridiculous reason for letting the Turks overrun them? Is it necessary to point out that the Turks also sat out WW2? Call me someone with high standards, but to me this kind of remark disqualifies someone as CINC. We could scarcely be doing worse if the Jeff Daniels or Jim Carrey characters from their 1994 movie were calling the shots.

[bruce]

Politics has been said to make strange bedfellows. Guess this is just one of many cases where that saying is proven true. JMHO. Sincerely. bruce.

[lyman]

Back to the OP, is it okay to cite the Kurds' lack of military action with us in WW2 as an objectively ridiculous reason for letting the Turks overrun them? Is it necessary to point out that the Turks also sat out WW2? Call me someone with high standards, but to me this kind of remark disqualifies someone as CINC. We could scarcely be doing worse if the Jeff Daniels or Jim Carrey characters from their 1994 movie were calling the shots.

curious,


would you want the US, NATO or the UN to carve up or rather carve out a section or area and declare it Kurdistan?


I read elsewhere that Churchill proposed that , but another plan was already in place during WW1 that prevented it,


(and likely caused most if not all the issues in that area today)

- - - Updated - - -

Back to the OP, is it okay to cite the Kurds' lack of military action with us in WW2 as an objectively ridiculous reason for letting the Turks overrun them? Is it necessary to point out that the Turks also sat out WW2? Call me someone with high standards, but to me this kind of remark disqualifies someone as CINC. We could scarcely be doing worse if the Jeff Daniels or Jim Carrey characters from their 1994 movie were calling the shots.

curious,


would you want the US, NATO or the UN to carve up or rather carve out a section or area and declare it Kurdistan?


I read elsewhere that Churchill proposed that , but another plan was already in place during WW1 that prevented it,


(and likely caused most if not all the issues in that area today)

[togor]

False choice. The correct answer is to deter dictators from putting their armies on the move to exacerbate ethnic grudges militarily. And don't be fooled by the "endless wars" gimmickry of Trump. Those troops were there to help stabilize the region and to provide support to the Kurds' who were fighting ISIS. Remember ISIS? Candidate Trump said we were going to defeat them (and take their oil but never mind). I'm trying to remember the old saying, but I don't think it's "if you want something done right get the Turks to do it for you". That doesn't sound right.

Trump leaves his supporters with the lousiest positions to defend.

[lyman]

False choice. The correct answer is to deter dictators from putting their armies on the move to exacerbate ethnic grudges militarily. And don't be fooled by the "endless wars" gimmickry of Trump. Those troops were there to help stabilize the region and to provide support to the Kurds' who were fighting ISIS. Remember ISIS? Candidate Trump said we were going to defeat them (and take their oil but never mind). I'm trying to remember the old saying, but I don't think it's "if you want something done right get the Turks to do it for you". That doesn't sound right.

Trump leaves his supporters with the lousiest positions to defend.

not a false choice,


think about it , do we back or have agreements with an ethnic group or do we have agreements (right or wrong) with nations?

[togor]

not a false choice,


think about it , do we back or have agreements with an ethnic group or do we have agreements (right or wrong) with nations?

Clearly we went from telling the Turks that it was NOT OK for them to overrun the Kurds, to Trump all by himself telling Turkey that it WAS OK to overrun the Kurds. If you ask US military commanders on the ground in northern Syria, they would tell you that they had relations with the local Kurdish forces, who, if not a country, were nonetheless an organized force capable of making and keeping agreements. And in civil war situations, like this, factions get backed that are not necessarily the incumbent government.

So yes, given the complexities, I see your either-or proposition as a false choice.

Here is a hypothetical, if anyone wants to have a go: Trump runs on an isolationist platform and beats FDR in 1940. What happens after that? Discuss.

[togor]

Actual quotes from the Saudis:

In a conversation after the talk, Prince Khaled also said that Mr. Trump’s pullout of Syria had increased the influence in the region of the Russian president, Vladimir V. Putin, a main sponsor of the Syrian government.

“Russia is becoming an important player in the region — whether one likes it or not, it is a fact,” Prince Khalid said.

“The Russians,” he said, “do to a certain extent understand the East better than the West does.”

Too bad Q-anon or the deep state or whatever couldn't save Trump from himself on this one. But then again Trump is delivering for his patron, the guy who gave him the blueprint for running (chaos and disinformation) and helped him in 2016. Trump counts on his support for 2020. Don't let anyone say differently.

[Vern Humphrey]

I propose those who are pro-Kurd go to Syria and fight for them.

[togor]

I propose those who are pro-Kurd go to Syria and fight for them.

Sure yeah that's how it works. Bogus.

Oh and for the "Donald knows what he's doing for some deep reason that never saw the light of day until just now but believe us, it was there all along" crowd, Trump just reacted by jacking up Turkish steel tariffs. True he could have done this for any reason, but the timing suggests that his gut was wrong on this one. He overruled pretty much everyone, made a call, and ka-bam! Faster than you can say "Jimmy Carter" it blew up in his face. Nonetheless, in Trump We Trust. But hey Donald, how about next time you actually read the briefing PowerPoint, all 3 slides of it in 32 point font.

[lyman]

Actual quotes from the Saudis:


Too bad Q-anon or the deep state or whatever couldn't save Trump from himself on this one. But then again Trump is delivering for his patron, the guy who gave him the blueprint for running (chaos and disinformation) and helped him in 2016. Trump counts on his support for 2020. Don't let anyone say differently.

regardless of who the president it, this part of the quote is true,

“The Russians,” he said, “do to a certain extent understand the East better than the West does.”

[Roadkingtrax]

I propose those who are pro-Kurd go to Syria and fight for them.

We were.

[togor]

And Lyman that's why the rich Arabs send their kids to school in Russia, because they are just so much more on the ball there.