Joe's success

[barretcreek]

Will Joe's outstanding conclusion to Afghanistan adversely affect Newsom in the recall? The 'Rats are going down on all their fronts. Minority support is lessening, idols such Cuomo and Barack are suddenly being seen for the frauds some of us recognized years ago. Biden is flaming out even faster than many anticipated and I can't think of any arena in which they are not batting close to 0.

“I hope the Taliban is at least addressing our people by their preferred pronouns.”

[togor]

What happened to us not being the world's policeman?

If someone really is committed to that idea, then now is the time to step up.

[oscars]

I don’t recall Biden offering to host the Taliban at Camp David. Didn’t Trump set the drawdown date of May 1? Trump comment “I would have jawed the Taliban into a drawdown of my choosing”

[oscars]

I heard Bush 43’s speech following 9/11. He promised to go after the perpetrators, destroy them and obliterate their training facilities. Within a little more than a year, the US had largely accomplished these goals and recaptured Kandahar while blocking the remains of the Taliban/Al Queda in the caves of Tora Bora. Nowhere did Bush mention building highways, acting as community organizers or educating segments of the population as goals. Having accomplished the original goals, the US dhoild have declared victory and come home with the assurance of a severely degraded terrorist force.

[Art]

I heard Bush 43?s speech following 9/11. He promised to go after the perpetrators, destroy them and obliterate their training facilities. Within a little more than a year, the US had largely accomplished these goals and recaptured Kandahar while blocking the remains of the Taliban/Al Queda in the caves of Tora Bora. Nowhere did Bush mention building highways, acting as community organizers or educating segments of the population as goals. Having accomplished the original goals, the US dhoild have declared victory and come home with the assurance of a severely degraded terrorist force.

That is part of the goal. The other part was to permanently deny Afghanistan as a base to terrorist organizations. That part is now over too. Severely degraded terrorist organizations don't necessarily stay degraded and the "Holy Warriors" are never, never going to quit. We can expect the crazies to have a safe base in Afghanistan once again, and to have it without fear of outside intervention, at least by the west. Equally disturbing is the abandonment of thousands of people who had cooperated with us who will now be at the tender mercy of the Taliban. That looks bad. We didn't have a good reputation for taking care of those who helped us before this absolute debacle. In addition we put the other people who had personnel on the ground, especially the Brits and the Frogs in an awful situation of having to precipitously cut and run too. If I was the government of Taiwan I'd be feeling a little more nervous than I did yesterday.

There were wars we should not have fought after 911. Iraq and Libya are prime examples where we expended vast amounts of blood and treasure ultimately making things worse. This is different. This is a debacle of almost Biblical proportions, both on the military and intelligence phases. Whether those failures are due to the analysis of the professionals or the Administrations failure to heed them doesn't really matter now.

It's worse than the fall of Saigon because the down the road consequences could extend well beyond the borders of Afghanistan.

[BudT]

Joe has no successes except disaster to this country and this Afghan thing is all Obama and Joe's. Trump made decisions based on what was given to him by the Military, hair sniffer and Barry did what they and the left wanted. Joe is to incompetent to understand whats going on here and is best left in a corner some where discovering all the chocolate ice cream he wants in the back of his pants. I just hope this doesn't turn into another Benghazi as I wouldn't put it past these perverts to abandon our troops there in a chit situation. China is moving to recognize the Taliban as the government and the blood bath will start. Keep a eye on China and them making a move on Taiwan, hair sniffer wont do any thing there either then most of the south pacific. History repeating itself. Hair sniffer will abandon the people that helped us.
BudT

[togor]

Art,

It can also be argued that:

1) there are plenty of other lands with weak governance where terrorists can set up shop (Africa comes to mind.)

2) the Arabs who fought the Soviets and made up the core of Al Qaeda are long dead.

3) 9/11 was allowed to happen because of monumental eff-ups in US intelligence. The signs were there if only someone could read them.

4) It remains to be seen if the Taliban will be eager to get back into the global terrorism hosting business. Whatever the cost has been to us in the last 20 years, they did not exactly get off free.

5) Afghanistan needs money. They are less likely to get that from the west if they return to their old ways as though the last 20 years didn't happen.

6) Trump, that stopped-clock of politicians, was right in what he said about endless wars.

Long story short, we spent 20 years trying to build something there and the locals gave it up in a fortnight. We ought to accept that for what it is instead of doubling down for an indefinite stay.

[lyman]

Art,

It can also be argued that:

1) there are plenty of other lands with weak governance where terrorists can set up shop (Africa comes to mind.)

2) the Arabs who fought the Soviets and made up the core of Al Qaeda are long dead.

3) 9/11 was allowed to happen because of monumental eff-ups in US intelligence. The signs were there if only someone could read them.

4) It remains to be seen if the Taliban will be eager to get back into the global terrorism hosting business. Whatever the cost has been to us in the last 20 years, they did not exactly get off free.

5) Afghanistan needs money. They are less likely to get that from the west if they return to their old ways as though the last 20 years didn't happen.

6) Trump, that stopped-clock of politicians, was right in what he said about endless wars.

Long story short, we spent 20 years trying to build something there and the locals gave it up in a fortnight. We ought to accept that for what it is instead of doubling down for an indefinite stay.

#1, only North Africa has supported terrorist, and there are likely some still there,

I doubt the rest of the country has a stomach for it , if they can afford it,

#2,, doubt there were many Arabs in the country, they make up less than 4% now,
and you may not make friends calling an Afgan an Arab

#4, given time, they may, depends on how much money flows from Pakisatan and China,

#5, see #4, and China is looking hard, if they are not already there, at the minerals etc that can be mined,
opium will always flow,

[Roadkingtrax]

I don?t recall Biden offering to host the Taliban at Camp David. Didn?t Trump set the drawdown date of May 1? Trump comment ?I would have jawed the Taliban into a drawdown of my choosing?

The RNC cleaned up their website today to distance themselves from support of the Afghanistan withdrawal.

I wonder what those newly released 5000 Taliban warlords are doing now that brokered release during the previous administration?

[togor]

#2, Al Qaeda relocated back to Afghanistan in '96 after the Taliban took over. Before that in places like East Africa ("Blackhawk Down" era.) But the core were Arabs who fought jihad against the Soviets. None of the 9/11 terrorists were Afghan nationals. But they were based there and indoctrinated there by OBL.

#5. China and India have mining rights there. Remains to be seen if those concessions are enough to keep the economy running. A lot of expat money was flowing in, not unlike Cuba. That may or may not continue. Will the Paki government underwrite the Afghan economy? Point is, there may be a financial incentive for the Taliban to not repeat their behavior of the 1990s.

[lyman]

#2, would counter that OBL had some support, but was still in the minority, religion wise,


#5, I have a hunch , taliban or not, that the warlords will be back in power soon,
they (warlords) may be getting or may get some $$ from many places,
and if they think the tailban, or arabs, or a future group, will cut that off, they may take care if it,,

[barretcreek]

Taliban are only interested in goats and little children; money for running a Gov't is beyond their intellect.

So back to my question. Will all this success by the Blue Party help Newsom or be more fresh meat for the hounds who'd like to run him up the flag pole in from of the capitol in Sacramento? Joe did call for voters to save Newsom.

[togor]

I doubt it registers in the California recall, if that is what you are asking. But we will see.

Moreover with Cuomo out in NY, one less thing for the GOP there to campaign on.

There are up sides to wars ending too. Though not necessarily for the liberal media, judging by how they are having a conniption about it.

[lyman]

I doubt it registers in the California recall, if that is what you are asking. But we will see.

Moreover with Cuomo out in NY, one less thing for the GOP there to campaign on.

There are up sides to wars ending too. Though not necessarily for the liberal media, judging by how they are having a conniption about it.

liberal media,,,


Richard Engels did a hit piece on how Americans left a base in Afgan (Kandahar, IIRC) in a shambles,
shut down the power, tore out computers etc so the ANA could not use them

like anyone would leave computer equipment around,,, I'm betting he would not leave them his personal laptop,,


glossed over the fact the hospital was fully supplied and in working order,


guessing the Afgan's have trouble turning on electricity, or have no money left for an IT dept?

[togor]

Impossible not to notice how the elites on both the right and left are bent out of shape by the end of the Afghanistan project. Only goes to show how disconnected they are from everyday practical reality, in the USA and Afghanistan both.